Our flight to England was booked way back in July for travel on December 24th. It was a coveted direct flight. We are travelling with a 19 month old and the direct flight was the ONLY reason we decided to book with Canada’s national airline. We actually paid EXTRA for the advantage of this direct flight. We only just found out by coincidence that our DIRECT flight was cancelled. The flight to London is now going via Toronto. At a completely different time. Not a polite notifcation or anything to let us know that our flight was cancelled. We would have showed up at the airport on Christmas Eve with our all our crap and a cranky 19 month old toddler only to be told that our flight was cancelled and we missed our new flight! Um, shouldn’t we be informed if our flight is cancelled? Apparently not according to the fantastic Customer Service asshole who answered my call. “If you have a complaint you need to write to us. You should receive a response in 15 – 20 days” Right. Ok then. Thanks again for your outstanding, exceptional customer service unfAir Canada!
—Westjet lover!
This article appears in Dec 3-9, 2009.
Flying is becoming so unpleasant.
It’s not just AC though, it’s across the board.
At least going to the UK one doesn’t need to go through US “customs”…
I used to fly with Air France, who once “lost” my luggage for 5 days (s) (which is better than forever I suppose)…but I did get a T-shirt, some soaps, a tooth-brush…and, get this, even a couple of branded Air France condoms!
From AC you’re lucky to get the time of day…
The condoms were so the next time you get screwed by Air France you can rest assured it’s safe sex.
Oh god, I sympathize with you Op. I live abroad too and often fly home to visit family. I’ve had such bad experiences with Air Canada. They are complete and utter assholes.
Look out for your stroller- I once stood for an hour and fifteen minutes at the oversized luggage drop-off, only to see the Air Canada baggage handlers throwing wheelchairs and strollers through the air at a distance of about 5 meters from the belt. Mine came crashing down so hard it broke 7 needed to be replaced. now when I come home, I come via Amercian Airlines, who for some reason( maybe more competition) seem to know how to treat their customers.
AC changed my flight once, I was supposed to be direct London to Halifax, instead I was re-routed thru Toronto.
Sitting beside me was a father and son, they were going to Toronto, but they re-routed his wife and she had to go thru, you guessed it, Halifax.
Fantastic.
I’m not usually one to make such blatant, absolute statements, but I must say that Air Canada is a horrible airline that I hope will one day go out of business. As others have stated both here and as I have heard millions of time, it’s their apalling customer service more than anything. I have flown with around a dozen airlines throughout my lifetime (and have heard both good and bad stories from other people on other ones) and I can say without a doubt that Air Canada is by far the worst for customer service. Air Canada sucks. I think I’d rather fly with Air Somalia.
Best airline I’ve ever flown with? Virgin Blue in Australia! WestJet is also good, and I’ve heard good things about Porter, as well.
Thanks for the laff Miles.
This is why I’m going through Continental. I don’t care if I have to route through New Jersey to get to England, fuck AC.
Honestly, why do people bitch about air travel so much? I’ve started thinking about it this way: You’re flying through the fucking air, people. A little over 100 years ago, this was impossible and crossing the Atlantic was a 2 week journey in the hull of a ship, fraught with dangers. People are just like impertinent 8-year-olds when it comes to this shit.
The bitch isn’t about air travel itself! It’s about the poor customer service of the airlines these days!
Again, it’s fucking air travel. That is, you strap yourself to a seat, and travel through the skies, and land, safely, in another city, across the ocean! The customer service aspect of it is the fact that you get to a place that would take you a significantly large amount of time to travel to by any other means. We should all be so lucky.
Besides, who brings a 19 month old onto a plane? Right, selfish parents who think it’s okay to travel with a 19 month old! Christ, when the little guy’s ears pop, he’ll pop the ears of everyone else on the plane when the pain forces the kid to cry the entire flight.
Are you kidding me, Dr Fever?? I’m selfish because I live abroad and so need to travel home a few times a year so I can see my family and have my child know his grandparents aunts and uncles?? Fuck you!!
completely valid bitch. fuck you Dr. Fever
Yeah, let’s all us parents go into fucking hiding. How fucking dare we take our kids anywhere that involves sharing space with ignorant, intolerant, hyper-sensitive, judgemental, chronically self-important, childless assholes! Let alone, risk our kids having a cry while in line at the fucking drycleaners; because, you know, it’s just so fucking selfish of US to expect anyone without a child to possibly have a shred of a moment’s fucking tolerance to a fussy baby!
And another thing, Dr Fever; like any other service being offered which I am required to pay for, I fucking expect a level of customer service that is proportionate to the fucking price I pay for said service- whether it’s in the sky or on the ground. And who gives a shit that flying has only been around for about 100 years? So has pretty much everything else people buy these days. See many people purchasing granite wheels and feather-quill pens, lately, Fever ??
When I pay for air travel, I expect not to have to listen to a screaming baby’s crying for hours and hours.
Give ’em hell, Fever! =D
I’m so sick of parents playing the selfish card when trying to put down people who choose not to have kids. Having children in an overpopulated society such as ours us far more selfish than not having them.
But I digress, I’m pretty sure all airlines warn you when you buy your tickets that you need to verify your flights, in advance as they are subject to change. If the customer service agents had to call every passenger of each flight that was changed you’d never get through to make reservations. Would you really have gone to the airport 2 hours before the flight that you booked 6 months earlier without checking on it the day before?
Thank you scooby! It is NOT selfish that I want my son to know his Grandparents in England! If we have to fly or whatever why the hell shouldn’t we? What the hell is the difference to you or anyone else? And why should my family be restricted from travel becuase my child might or might not cry??? He might cry on the bus, or the train, or at the grocery store, the Dr’s office…..he’s a damn baby!!! I don’t know if you know anything at all but sometimes babies cry! Jesus, I guess according to all you narrow minded assholes, everyone with babies or children should be shut away from civilization.
Scooby, you paid to fly across the fucking ocean, not to have your ass wiped by a flight attendant. Airline fuel isn’t cheap, not to mention the qualified pilots who fly the plane, and last but not least, the aforementioned flight attendants. That’s the service you pay for. Go to Kenya and fly the national airline there for pennies on the dollar. Then, after your plane crashes, give me a call and tell me that paying 1500 dollars for round trip airfare sounds good for the level of service that’s provided (i.e.: flying across the country/ocean and landing safely). Need I mention that you’re not required to fly anywhere, thereby not required to pay for any level of service. There are other means to travel over the ocean.
Secondly, once that child’s ears pop, that child will become a holy terror. Yep, that’s all good.
I’m not saying that children shouldn’t be isolated from society, I’m just saying that maybe taking a toddler on a plane isn’t such a good idea. But, I don’t have a kid, what the hell would I know? I really hope somebody swivels around and tells your kid to shut the fuck up. I know I would.
Actually, our “society” is depopulating. We have to rely on immigrants to keep our industry running — just take a basic HR econ course!
People having kids really isn’t doing much for our “overpopulation”….because it doesn’t exist!
I like Air Canada. They switched my flight in a similar manner once, and I called them up and they fixed it. Westjet was annoying, what with the cutesy announcements and crap. Air Canada has been pure class during all my flights. Don’t get me started on Jetsgo.
Screw the condoms. To fly this baby, bring your own roll of duct tape. My guess is the vodka is free flowing and if not, it should be.
http://englishrussia.com/?p=1832&fr=2l
GirlyGirly— while Russian airlines have a less than reputable name, I can tell you from experience that emergency exit in Russian is not “salida de emergencia”… maybe in Mexico it is, but not Russia.
Haha, glad you noticed Dr. Fever … Maybe it’s for the benefit of all those illegal aliens they import, to pick them cotton fields…just saying!
Either way, it’s a scary looking plane, whatever flag it flies.
Nobody here played the “selfish card” but Dr Fever, People Are Stupid, so fuck off.
Exactly Dr Fever, what the hell would you know??? And if my normally well-behaved baby happened to cry on a flight and somene like YOU turned around to tell him to ‘shut the fuck up’, I guarantee they’d have a fistfull of hair missing from their scalp when they de-boarded the plane.
And just to reiterate, Peope Are Stupid, I have never played the ‘selfish card’ when referring to childless people. I was responding to Fever’s accusation that parents who fly with babies are “selfish”!
As for the old “Having children in an overpopulated society such as ours us far more selfish than not having them.” philosophy, well aren’t you just the revolutionary!! Give yourself a nice pat on the back for such original thinking, because you’re just so super brilliant!!
man, some of you sound as whiney as your kids are going to be….
and I’m pretty sure a 19 month old isn’t going to know shit about anyone he sees at that age.
don’t know about you but I certainly don’t remember the good old year when I was 1.
Perhaps you meant that it was for the family to meet the sniveling shit-machine.
So what if he doesn’t remember, zZz? What the hell does that have to do with anything??? Ok, so I won’t let him meet anyone or do anything outside of the home…..because “he won’t remember it” anyway. Long-lasting conscious memory of specific events develops when a baby is between 14 and 18 months old. But what would you know you sniveling shit-machine.
Wow intense bitch! I’ve only flown twice, and I found my experience with Westjet to be much better… but I don’t have a lot to compare it to.
On another note, since it seems to be a part of the discussion… I don’t have kids, but hope to someday. And for all those people who think that people shouldn’t have kids because of overpopulation: who do you think is going to pay the taxes to support your health care etc when you’re older? We are facing a huge problem, especially in Nova Scotia, where by 2026 the number of people over 65 in the province will outnumber the amount of people under 65. Just a thought…
Air Canada SUCKS plain and simple. How else could you explian the fact that a business with a virtual monopoly and federal funding could go tits up about 8 times?!?! Hint. It is not because they provide exceptinal service!! I tarevl for a living and will go out of my way to fly west jet. The difference is night and day. West Jet actually make you feel that they feel privileged to have you choose to fly with them> Air Canada gives me teh impression that it is ME who should feel privileged to be on their plane.
Anyone tried to get a hold of WestJet in the last month or so? They completely dropped the ball with their attempt to switch over to their new booking system and have hold times of at least an hour most of the time. That’s not particularly good customer service either.
However, I was once was on a flight home to Hali in December and got redirected to NB because of snow. They were going to refuel and take the plane back to where we came from, but I had a family emergency and needed to get to Halifax that night. They were kind enough not only to let me off the plane, which was against the rules, but they actually paid for a cab to take me to Halifax too. They didn’t have to do any of that…they can’t control the weather.
But I’ve flown AC lots of times without any problems too. I usually let cost determine which airline I fly, but WJ’s kindness did win them some loyalty points.
Also, I’ve started packing ear plugs and iPods to deal with noisy babies. If that fails I also have sleeping pills….for the baby though, I like to stay awake for the in-flight movie.
Dr. Fever, I’m surprised at the stance you’ve tacken on this bitch. Usually I agree with you on most of your comments but lately you’ve been snarkier than usual.
I’ve flown a lot in the course of my life, and have had good and bad experiences with each airline. (well I’ve only flown porter once and that was an excellent experience, but I digress). My main point here is about kids on airplanes: Sometimes kids scream and cry for a short while on flights and, woah, sometimes they DON’T. Similarly, sometimes adults barf their guts out on flights, stinking up the cabin and generally grossing out all the other passengers but sometimes they don’t. Or they have an explosive shit in the bathroom that makes the rest of the flight unbearable (seriously, do some people save up for the airplane bathroom?!) or whatever. Adults can be just as unpleasant to fly with as children, so don’t be so fucking ignorant about it!
“Secondly, once that child’s ears pop, that child will become a holy terror”
It’s actually not that bad… I was on a flight about a month ago, and there was a baby on the plane; of course the child’s ear drums popped, it (I don’t know the gender of the baby) cried for 5-10 minutes, then was quiet for the rest of the flight.
Everyone’s acting like when I child starts crying, it’s never gonna end… Guess what, they do settle down. Jus take a lesson from Miles, and pack earphones or ear plugs…
Hell you don’t even have to pack ear phones… The flight attendants sell them :p
sickntired : “So what if he doesn’t remember, zZz? What the hell does that have to do with anything???”
scoobydoo : “I’m selfish because I live abroad and so need to travel home a few times a year so I can see my family and have my child know his grandparents aunts and uncles??”
suppose I took it as scooby was the OP, since he/she/it flamed on pretty fierce there….
potentially my bad. I’ve flown enough though to know to bring some music or ear plugs because the more I pay for a flight, the more incessant whining goes on… from both Rtards and kids pestering everyone.
‘so I won’t let him meet anyone or do anything outside of the home…..because “he won’t remember it” anyway’ …
do what you want (you will whether I say to or not anyways…), but don’t think he’ll remember. It will have little to no impact to him…. and you won’t be able to ask when he’s three and able to talk why he was screaming bloody murder at the worm that crawled on his shoe.
hey Zzz, I can definetly see why you’d think it might be me, but it wasn’t- I just really relate to the OP’s complaint because I’ve flown so often in the last year, and am about to again in 2 weeks (same as the OP, no direct flights)
Again, the customer service aspect of flying is the fact that you get there in one piece. Flying is a luxury, not a right, child or no child. Get over the fact that you’re whining about “my flight was delayed…” or “I had to take 2 planes to get across the ocean”. It’s a stupid bitch.
….and so are you, Dr Fever.
Who here mentioned anything about flying being a “right,” anyway?
I certainly get that vibe, because everyone’s up in arms over the fact that somebody didn’t get a direct flight and that people feel that they somehow have a right to get their ass wiped because they paid 1500 buck for a ticket. It’s a perfectly rational argument.
“The customer service aspect of it is the fact that you get to a place that would take you a significantly large amount of time to travel to by any other means. We should all be so lucky.”
Wow Dr fever, that’s deep! Ok so I get it; the employees of a particular airline can do as crappy a job as they like, as long as you arrive in one piece. They should be free to conduct themselves any old way they like once clocked in for their shift! Who cares if all your luggage was lost, or anything else? Gosh darn it, just be grateful you weren’t one of the unfortunate souls who sank on one of the famine boats travelling from Ireland to America back around 1850!
Scooby,
“because, you know, it’s just so fucking selfish of US to expect anyone without a child…”
That’s not playing the selfish card? You are clearly implying that it’s people with kids vs people without, and someone is selfish, but it’s not you. Hmm, who does that leave…?
And great retaliation by the way. Calling me brilliant, I’m so offended that I suddenly take back everything I’ve said.
Think globally and act locally. You can’t say that oh, my country is underpopulated, therefore I should have lots of kids. The planet is overpopulated, so no matter where you live you have to think of yourself as adding to the already billions of people living here. And that’s not to say that no one should have kids. It’s just to say that if you are in fact thinking about the greater whole and not just what you want, you would reconsider having a/nother child. Adopt one that is already part of the population maybe.
You really don’t get it. The fact that you get there in one piece is what you pay for. Everything else is gravy. 90% of the time, people are satisfied, despite the rising costs and declining service. The remaining 10% of the time people tend to make it a massive issue and start flailing about, saying dumbass shit like “we should have a passenger bill of rights!”. While I agree that sometimes the airlines in Canada occasionally make a dick move or two, I feel that complaining about the fact that your direct flight was changed into a stop over is completely inconsequential. I guess I cpuld take my own advice and realise, hey, at least it’s not someone whining about the fact that they had to sit on the tarmac for 15 minutes. Flights change. Thus is life. Either go or not. You will, simply because you can’t get a refund (one of the aforementioned dick moves). There are better and more important things to worry about. Seriously.
The reason, I expect, that so many infants cry their little hearts out…is that the experience of flying must be, as Dr Fever has IMO correctly surmised, a terrifying one.
Not just the ear-popping, but the noise, the movement of the plane, the confusion…the effect on the inner ear as well.
Why not try something original? You have a child now, so why not ‘cancel’ the exotic travel plans for a couple or three years and stay home with it?
I’m sure there is eveidence that some infants are irrovocably dameged by this trauma. Funny how some parents will scowl and cry about a few parts per million of tobacco wafting near their papoose…and then subject it to an oxygen-poor, uneven air-pressure, germ-filled noisy and vibrating environment…all so they can “travel the world” like they were 21 again.
Grow up, and take some responsibility for your decision to have children, and leave the travelling to the rest of us, at least until your brood is old enough to be told to shut the fuck up…
“” I feel that complaining about the fact that your direct flight was changed into a stop over is completely inconsequential.”‘
Indeed.
In today’s economy, airlines are working at a very low margin, and have little choice but to re-route, change some times and so on inorder to keep the plane full of fare-paying passengers.
The days of being able to whimsically cancel your booking at the last moment, or change it 5 times without penalty, carry 15 suitcases full of shoes, and expect to be treated like royalty all the way through the process, are over.
For better or worse, this is the reality of flying. There WAS, I suppose, a “heydey” for cheap flights/premium service that spoiled us in the 70’s-90’s when fuel was 40 cents a litre, regulations were looser regarding maintenance etc…but there’s too many people trying to fly these days…it’s like a human rush hoiur, especially during peak times.
Personally, I was happy when fuel went to $150 a barrel….bring back the transatlantic passenger ships, says I…but this time add some hi-tech “sails” to help out. Now THAT would be cool.
The kids have just as much right to be on the plane as anyone else as long as mommy’s paid for the ticket. Putting up with kids is all part of the package when travelling. Same as putting up with smokers in the doorway is part of going to work these days. We all have to put up with shit we don’t like from time to time.
PAS: what if you want your own kids? I can see how you can call that ‘selfish’…but it’s not a negative kind of selfish? I see nothing truly selfish about wanting to be a parent or wanting to be a parent to someone who share’s your DNA.
Also, once the standard of living in some of these countries raises, the population growth rate will slow and eventually things will stabilize. Already we see people redistributing to access resources (immigration) since resources aren’t being equally distributed among the population.
when i was a wee one flying was a blast…candy, comic books and you got to see the cockpit (no jokes please) now they are just flying buses and you must cope with humanity…it can always be fun
“”The kids have just as much right to be on the plane as anyone else as long as mommy’s paid for the ticket.””
Don’t the little bastards still travel for free under 2?
We have always had those high- tech sailing vessels, but unfortunately our society has become addicted to instant gratification.
http://www.sailingshipadventures.com/index…
Flying is the safest way to travel. So maybe that means we should all stop whining about the bus.
Again, People Are Stupid:
I. Don’t. Think. Childless. People. Are. Selfish.
If only you could understood my comment correctly, you would realize that I was specifically referring to the ones who are. That being, the ones who whine about how “selfish” it is to fly with a baby.
…because it might bother their ears.
Miles is the best!
🙂
girlygrrl…yes, that’s cool.
I’m hoping for oil to reach $500 a barrel in my lifetime so I can see more of those.
If they can cross the Altlantic in, say, 7-10 days, and we re-think our lives and leisure time, that would be a neat future.
Maybe there could be a whole deck devoted to cycles/treadmills and giant hamster wheels, where you could help “work” your passage by generating some power for the thrusters!
Bring your pets!
Ya, I’ll bring my little Gucci bag filled with my pets, along with their own teeny wind turbines. Hell, they are not sailing for free.
I say if those damn Arabs wanna sell their evil oil to us for 500 bucks a barrel, I say let’s sell them a bushel of wheat for the same price.
Of course wanting to raise a child is not selfish, as long as your intent is for the good of the child. But if you have the option to adopt a child, and you choose to have your own because you want the child to have your DNA, that is definitely one of the most selfish things you can do. You are not doing any benefit to the uncreated child by bringing it into existence, but there are thousands of children who will never know the love of a parent.
And the idea that the population will just level out is a myth. The only thing that will stop the population from growing is a food shortage.
How is wanting to create life with your partner selfish? The desire to procreate is a fundamental drive in life. Wanting your own genetic material to survive by having children is no more selfish than wanting yourself to survive. So yes, it may technically be selfish, but it’s not selfish in the negative way you seem to be implying. Adopting a child in need is a very nice thing to do, but I don’t think opting to have your own kids over adopting is somehow less good. They are both good actions for different reasons.
And I’m not saying that the population will “just level out”, I am suggesting that the growth rate will slow enough for technology and social conscience to offer solutions to some of the problems we face today. With effort, I think the population can attain sustainability without war or famine.
“cockpit”
Posted by paingirl on December 7, 2009 at 8:07 PM
Heheheh… heheheheheheheheh.
Heheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheh!
Hahahahaha… hahahahaha… haha… ohh my.
I agree with you though, I too loved flying when I was a young’n. Especially when the plane was experiencing turbulence. Actually, I still have fun when the plane’s experiencing turbulence! Helps to save you from those boring conversations you sometimes end up having with one of your fellow passengers.
Wow, I didn’t intend this bitch to become so heated. It was purely a ‘vent’ at the frustration I was feeling towards the airline at the time. I totally appreciate the fact that air travel is a luxury and that times and schedules change. I was purely frustrated with the service I received from AC….. I also appreciate there are way more important and valid things to complain about, but what is the purpose of this very site but to “bitch” about the many irritations of life – significant or otherwise?
I do, however, take offense to the whole lot of you who seem to have an extreme (and irrational) hate on for babies and children (which totally has nothing to do with the actual bitch). You know, we’re not all bad parents. Not every child is horrible (although they can have their moments!). Children live on the same planet as we do. Someday they will even grow up to be contributing citizens. Some may even end up wiping your sorry asses when you start shitting yourselves. So even folks who would never have kids should be aware of basic child behavior and not get completely bent out of shape when a child fails to act just like an adult might.
Wow, people ARE stupid, have you ever tried to adopt a child? You act like there are orphanages everywhere and anyone can just walk in and save a baby or child by adopting them. There are tonnes of hoops to jump through, and lots of concerns for adoptive parents that biological parents don’t have to deal with. Your ignorance amazes me! Didn’t you hear that even Madonna herself was turned away?
Seeing as how we’re already off-topic with the whole “kids’ angle, let’s look at the adoption part – yes, people wanting to adopt (or become foster parents, even), are required to jump through hoops to have the “privilege” of adopting, but any two fertile people of the opposite sex can go at it and procreate, providing body scheduling is right and no birth control is used. Now *THAT* is worth a bitch…
As far as young children on a plane are concerned, it’s a fact of life. Yes, I might be exhauseted and unable to sleep because of a screaming baby in a seat near me, but it’s a risk I take when I fly somewhere, so I don’t say anything. Except sometimes to the poor stressed-out, embarassed parent, to see if I can make them smile or feel as though someone commisserates.
What I *DO* hate about any sort of public place where you can find children, are irresponible parents who think the rest of the people in the space should be responsible for babysitting their little angel. I undertand kids are quick and can get away from you occasionally, this is NOT the type of situation I am talking about.
I am talking about the type of parent who wanders away from their child, shopping, who turns their back on a three year old in a store for 25 minutes and then gets pissed at the staff for not watching him.
Or the stupid “C word” a few years ago who let her 4 and 5 year olds run rampant in Pearson Airport while her back was completely turned on them – I had to physically extract her son’s bleeding hand from the baggage carousel. While I am standing there holding her screaming, crying, bleeding child, she turned around and sauntered the 300 yards back to where I was. No “thanks” no “are they ok”, no “who the hell are you”, she just took their hands, and walked away.
If you’re going to have children, don’t have disdain for them. Some people aren’t lucky enough to have them – biologically or not…
Luckily, people like Dr Fever and Zzz seem to be pretty few and far between; that is, anywhere besides this site. So far, I’ve yet to sit near anyone- be it a man, woman, teenager or old person on a plane who wasn’t extremely helpful and friendly towards my baby and I. He’s a pretty good traveller thus far- only crying when I have to hold him tight against me during take-off, and I bring along whatever distractions I think might minimize the chances of him crying. Knowing there are people like Miles, Jennier and Lanesr out there really helps, and it’s people like that which make me care very much that my child behaves well in public- whether on a plane, at a restaurant, or anywhere else.
But scoobydoo, if what you say about your parenting skills is true (and we have no reason to doubt you), then you are *not* one of those parents (nor are your kids) people like Fever and Zzz are talking about.
I wish just for one day, the actual people who *should* see themselves in our posts were magically able to do so, and to recognize themselves, and maybe, just *maybe* make a few changes. Alas, it is people who *aren’t* the jerks to whom we’re referring who are just insulted by things that have(apparently) nothing to do with them… *SIGH*
True Gidget, but Fever was the one who made the statement that parents who fly with children are “selfish,” and that’s what sparked my rage!
PAS could just as easily be People Are Selfish as much as they are Stupid. I really never said whether being selfish about having children was bad or good, I understand the idea of being selfish when it comes to wanting a miniature version of yourself or your partner. It is what people want to do just like animals, who often abandon offspring of killed parents. Or even kill the offspring of others. I’m saying it’s more selfish than choosing not to bring another life to the planet.
And btw, I don’t hate kids, even when they’re crying. I quite like (most) kids, and even teach youth workshops. I just don’t let that get in the way of being realistic about things.
Maybe for some it’s all about having a child you created, but I think for alot of people it’s also about the challenge of bringing adpoted children into their home; not a newborn (everyone wants a newborn so the waiting lists are years long, unless you can afford to go abroad), but an already-formed charecter, likely with issues that require more than the average kid who wasn’t put up for adoption. I think and hope that I might be up for that challenge one day, but only after I’m sure that I’m doing a well-enough job with the baby I’ve had the advantage of raising from birth. I like to think I’m doing a good job so far, but he’s only 15 months righ now, so time will tell. I know someone who fosters 3 older kids (siblings) to go with the son she had, and it takes excellent experience to get that little person over all the past bumps and bruises (mentally or figuratively) they’ve had to endure with their natural parents or in foster care.