Ok Fuck. I know you’ve grown up with a fucking silver spoon crammed up your collective asses, but here’s something that all you idiots who are trying to hijack both the spirit and the meaning of November 11 AND the inherent significance of the RED poppy seem to be missing. Ready for it? OK, here it comes…’Peace doesn’t come free’.
There,get it now? I realize that you may want to espouse your point, but please don’t try and ride the coattails of this venerable and distinct socially visible manifestation of the debt which we owe and the ritual that we observe to thank those who fought and gave their lives.
That’s right, it’s not a day to say, ‘Oh that was so bad’ or ‘War is useless’ . What it IS, in fact, is a day for non-partisan participation in a visible show of collective REMEMBRANCE! So take your white poppies and fucking peddle in a manner which not only slaps the veterans in the face, but makes both you and your message overbearing. —VetGuy
This article appears in Nov 4-10, 2010.
Actually peace is free. We were born free, we evolved from a species born in freedom.
Yeah if only people would have thought of that brilliant argument when they were being taken as prisoners of war, and their home was being occupied by a foreign totalitarian army.
“But sir! I evolved from apes! And… and they were FREE!!!”
I haven’t seen or heard of these before. I’ll wear my real poppy with pride.
I have my poppy already! For my grampy. 🙂
Although the concept has been around since the 1920’s I first encountered them in the mid 80’s when Veterans Against Nuclear Arms began pushing them. I found them offensive then and I find them offensive now, but as that left-wing icon Donald Rumsfeld put it so eloquently – “Freedom is messy”. It doesn’t make the monkey’s fist in my gut disappear but it is a right that they have.
I’ll be sticking with my red one.
In Ottawa a couple are planning to lay a wreath of white poppies after the official ceremony.
I plan on removing any such wreaths in metro.
Peace is expensive in so many ways. One must be willing to fight to protect it.
Peace isn’t expensive, FREEDOM is. I just wish that this group stealing the good name of the poppy, on Rememberance Day, could find something origional to drive home their point. The idea of the poppy comes from Flanders Field, which is a real place where real soldiers who died for our freedom are buried, which just happens to be covered with poppies. Leave the poppy alone and just remember that shock value may come full circle and bite you in your unorigional asses. I hope i smell a lawsuit.
i agree vet guy, having a war is bad for everyone, more so for those who die in it. for some fool’s ideal. let the big shots get the fuck out there, with the grunts, but no, safety from a 1,000 miles away. fuck the rest of them too. REMEMBER WHAT THESE PEOPLE DIED FOR.
I will personally kick and/or pinch anyone I see with this white poppy BS. Dr. McCrae is spinning…
a poke in the ribs works everytime
Monty will pee on them… I will not go into what Riley will do…
I’ve never seen a white poppy … I got my RED poppies today…should carry some red spray paint to put on the white poppies
Oh yeah… in my anger I forgot to say: Thank you to those in the past and present! I will always appreciate and remember.
the white poppy rears it’s ugly mug…every few years. piss off
Never heard of this white poppy thing before. Reading up on it, I don’t really understand what the big deal is. How is calling for peace or honoring all war casualties incompatible with remembering the sacrifice of soldiers? I was under the impression that the entire point of remembering that sacrifice was specifically to PROMOTE peace in the first place – they didn’t refer to it as ‘the war to end all wars’ because they thought it’d make for a catchy movie tagline. My great grandfather and all of his brothers were conscripted by the Germans and died in the trenches, does that mean I’m not allowed to participate in Remembrance Day because they were forced to fight on the losing side?
Or am I misinterpreting it entirely? You people make it sound like these people are wearing swastikas and are goose-stepping down Barrington St.
Vetguy, I am a vet also. I have lost friends and soldiers who worked for me in Bosnia and Afghanistan. If I see one white poppy its in my hands and destroyed. What an insult to those who have sacrificed life, limb and mental wellness for this country and the people who call it home.
Mentant, as the OB said the White Poppy is riding on the coattails of the Remembrance Poppy. Using the iconic image of the Poppy for anything else but remembering our fallen degenerates the meaning Remembrance Day.
Now, for those of you who offer violence and vandalism to the White Poppies, shame on you.
I’m not a fan of the military but I also will never wear a white poppy. Absolutely war is a terrible thing with a lot of spilled blood but that’s not what the (red) poppy is about; well, at least not to me. The white poppy, to me, is a failed marketing/PR ploy that takes away some valour from the vets of WWI, WWI, and Korea – where some deceased relatives served. Keep the red poppy please.
Hugo – That doesn’t answer anything, though. It’s tasteless because it rides on the coattails of the Remembrance Poppy: okay, HOW does it do that? Most comments I’ve come across rant about how tasteless the white poppy is but nobody seems to provide any specific reason why that’s the case. The only really concrete thing I’ve come across is that funds generated by white poppies generally don’t go to remembrance/legion funds. Which I can certainly understand would generate ire, but it seems like there’s more behind it than that.
I’m just confused by it. To be honest I’m not even entirely sure what the point of the white poppy is supposed to be in the first place – I’ve always been under the impression that remembering the sacrifices of war and the pursuit of peace were tied concepts and thus are both represented by the red poppy anyway. The white poppy seems redundant, I just don’t get what about it is supposed to be outright offensive.
Does the white poppy go towards veterans programs, legions or anything like that? I’ve always been content to donate some cash to a proud veteran for the red poppy but I cannot remember who or what created the white poppy.
White poppies can fuck off, leave it to our bitch-made generation to slap the people who fought for it in the face.
Anybody tries to sell me a white poppy I’ll stab them in the eye with it.
War is messy, and so are the issues surrounding how we choose to remember those who died as a result, whether as soldiers or noncombatants.
Here is an excerpt from the UK website http://www.whitepoppy.org.uk/
“The father of Canada’s only female soldier killed in Afghanistan, has said that he would be happy for his daughter to be remembered through the white poppy.
Tim Goddard’s daughter, Capt. Nichola Goddard, is the highest ranking Canadian soldier to die in Afghanistan. She died in fighting in May.
In an interview for Canadian Television, her father, Tim Goddard, who grew up in Britain, said that Remembrance Day had always been marked in the Goddard family.
Relatives had fought all the way back to the battle of the Somme in WW1.
Recognizing that red poppies only call for remembrance of those soldiers who died on one side of war, Mr Goddard said that Remembrance Day should be about remembering others who died too.
Mr Goddard said he remembered the white poppies while growing up in Britain and felt that they have their place on Remembrance Day.”
The argument about red vs white poppies has been going on for generations and it won’t be settled here. The Royal British Legion has no official objection to the white poppy and says folks can wear red or white or both – it’s a matter of personal choice. This is in contrast to the Royal Canadian Legion which has taken legal action against distributors of white poppies.
I don’t see the white poppy as a ‘slap in the face’ to veterans, who have long been remembered and honoured by the wearing of the red poppy. I see the white poppy as complementary to the red poppy and a symbol that memorializes the numerous innocent noncombatants who have also lost their lives to war.
Good comments Commandante. I think getting all worked up over a white poppy is kind of countering the peaceful thoughts and remembrance that should be done this time of year. I’ll always wear my red poppy, it means a lot to me, but I wouldn’t be adverse to wearing other symbols of remembrance during the year too.
Capt Goddard was not the most senior officer killed but one of three Captains killed in action(one by enemy fire and one falling into a hole) . There was one Major killed by a roadside bomb and a Colonel killed by a suicide bomber. Plus all the noncoms killed by various means.
I haven’t seen any white poppies yet. I work in a CF institution and I got my Remembrance Day parcel from Veterans Affairs yesterday, going to put up posters for Remembrance week today 🙂
A red poppy .
A white poppy !
I wonder when we’ll see a blue poppy ?
~:
After all, the country so proud of their red, white & blue, are our planets leading war makers !!
I think peoples, and my, unease with the white poppy comes from the sentiment of its distributors in Canada who plainly state “the red poppy romantizes war” while claming their white poppy symbolises peace. I can’t follow along with that reasoning, and white poppy wearers/supporters come off to me as ignorant and disrespectful of the Canadians and Allies who fought for and defend our freedoms.
Yes yes, war is terrible, and peace as an alternative to war is preferable. But white poppies infer that me as a red poppy wearer is a war-mongerer, which deeply insults me, imagine how that message is heard by vets? Do you honestly believe vets wished for war? The white poppy attempts to politicize and fracture what should be a very simple sentiment – “we will not forget”. If you want to advocate for a day/symbol/organization that opposes war please go right ahead, it is as noble a cause as any, but leave November 11 to the hundreds of thousands of Canadians and Allies who have made, and continue to make, unimaginable sacrifices for our freedom. This freedom was bought with blood, and is defended by blood, which is the sad truth. I for one view Nov11 as a way to pay respect to the many who stepped up to pay that price, not as an event to hum and haw over the morality of wars passed and present.
Very well said Walter. Thank you.
Walter…what if they (opposing Nations Governments) declared a war, & no one showed up ?
Wouldn’t that be a great day for al of humanity .
That would be the day mankind finally smartened up & realised war is the ultimate in Human’s being truely STUPID.
I believe that no country that declares war on another should be allowed to conduct that war, unless all members of the Governemtns that decided to go to war, are on the front lines.
IF the leaders & their cronies & all the rest of the generals, admirals, feild marshals or whatever other overblown titles these guy’s want to call themselves, had to be in the trenches on the front lines…. we would never, ever see another war.
But because they can send the countries young people off to war while they laze around in taxpayer paid for comfort, war will always be with us ! …and fools will always come up with excuses to why they ‘fight’ for their country !
Let the bashing begin
Not bashing More, but history is rather full of examples of “Suppose they gave a war and only ONE side came” Didn’t work out terribly well for the side that didn’t bother to “Show Up”. Blaming soldiers (of any rank) for war is about as nonsensical as blaming firefighters for fires. I’m willing to bet that if this world didn’t have any organized militaries, per se, we would still have plenty of militias, insurgents, guerillas, paramilitaries, resistants, maquis, jihadists, gangs – well you get the picture.
Since I cannot posit a community that doesn’t require police, I really cannot envision a world without war. Failure of imagination on my part – Perhaps. But I don’t see much evidence to refute it.
So again, I’m not bashing you for your thesis; I just do not feel that it jibes with reality.
I don’t think I am able to go there. I read you calling all our vets “STUPID” as well as calling all volunteering soldiers “fools”. If these are your true sentiments I can only shake my head. However I am assuming, and hoping, you are playing devils advocate.
What if, More….what if indeed.
Sad fact of life Walter – there will always be those who equate being anti-war with being anti-military or, even worse, anti-soldier (sailor, airman/woman).
“God and the soldier, we alike adore.
In times of trouble, and not before.
When trouble is over and wrong has been righted.
God is forgotten, and the soldier slighted.”
or
“It’s Tommy this an’ Tommy that an’ chuck ‘im out, the brute.
But it’s Saviour of ‘is country when the guns begin to shoot.”
I have never seen one of these white poppies, or a person wearing one. All the poppies I see are those nice red ones 🙂
Totally missed my point Snoop.
Let’s put it this way. If you are being attacked would you rather a soldier or a cop to protect you, or would you prefer a hare krishna or the Dalai Lama to protect you?
I love red poppy time! I love seeing the older vets selling them in the stores and such with their uniforms on with their medals. When I was in elementary, we used to have an assembly every year and a couple vets from WWI and WWII would come in and share their stories. I loved it, and as someone who’s studied WWI and WWII history, I think it’s a great way to raise money and keep the memories alive.
I bought my poppy as soon as they came out 🙂
I agree with this bitch. Fuck ANYONE who tries to marr the respect for the vets. They should be ashamed of themselves.
I like the pride you see in the vets’ faces when they pin a poppy on your lapel. It makes you feel really good.
Mentats. I get you now, personally I don’t find the White Poppies offensive, uncalled for yes, offensive no. Just like Prince Harry dressing as a Nazi, or those two fools in Ont., uncaled for yes, offensive no.
Right now I put the White Poppy in the same league a the commercialization of Christmas.
More.
In the Army, the men fight and the officers stay behind the lines.
In the Navy, they take the officers with them.
In the Air-force, the men stay at home and the officers go to war.
Ivan.
The wnd that blows,
The ship that goes,
And the lass that loved a sailor!
I think they should be allowed to wear the White Poppy, but it needs to be placed carefully, oh like the white patch Gary Gilmore wore, with the same end result.