http://www.cbc.ca/canada/ottawa/story/2010/02/08/belleville-jessica-lloyd-dead-missing.html
Of course “This story is closed to commenting”. Who can stand the backlash of our public broadcaster GLORIFYING the life and times of a common CRIMINAL. (murder, forcible confinement, break and enter, sexual assault) Who thought it might be a good idea to feature this idiot and his biography (!!!!!) all dressed up in his fancy uniform in a photo layout? He’s a killer! He’s kidnapped, killed and raped women who serve our country! That puts him up there with cop killers! DISGUSTING!
“walking confidently into the provincial courthouse”… OF COURSE HE IS! Look at the power those who protect him have! They’ve even got the CBC reporting this story in a favourable light for this RAPIST KILLER… or does CBC do that themselves? Considering “It was not immediately clear if the military has suspended Williams in the meantime, or if he will continue to be paid while he is relieved of his duties,” perhaps the CBC is covering their own asses as if a not guilty verdict will be reached? I think the CBC should be more concerned on the public’s position… the public that funds the CBC AND our military.
At the very least our public broadcaster should be interested to know how Canadians feel when we’re betrayed in the worst way by one of our own. Perhaps that photo display should be peppered with the looks of shock, disappointment and anger on the faces of Canadians who not only paid but also trusted this KILLER to serve. For all we know he’s smiling for his superiors and the cameras right after he dumped Jessica Lloyd’s raped, beaten body on the side of the road!
PURE DISGUST from this taxpayer!
—kay
This article appears in Feb 4-10, 2010.
Perhaps you should calm the fuck down and realize that you live in a country where we conduct trials before we assume guilt. How do you know he’s a killer? Where you there? Maybe they featured his bio because many people consider it shocking that such a person was arrested for this crime. Give it a year for the trial to be conducted and when they find him guilty,..then you can freak on him. Until then, accept the idea that people are “innocent until proven guilty”,..if not,..please move to another country.
He is innocent until proven guilty.
I think your hatred of the military is spilling into your bitch.
It’s alright CL. kay’s just being kay. She can’t voice her opinion, which infuriates her so much that she loses all semblance of sanity, which leads her to spew off about sheep, communists, and usually all in that order.
“PURE DISGUST from this taxpayer”! Hilarious!
I’m pretty sure that the story is closed to commenting for the sake of the victim’s family, not because of some the CBC is protecting the accused or whatever dumb-ass conspiracy you’ve cooked up. This happens all the time.
Not to mention most news comment pages are filled with trolls, and ignorant people who make the posters on LTWWB look like rainbows and butterflies
“Calm the fuck down” is NOT what I expected posting on love the way we BITCH.
Just for a minute imagine being the surviving family of the victims seeing this man PRAISED by imagery (a picture speaks 1000 words) for his life’s work in spite of (or as a DIRECT result of) his KILLING these women.
You know and I know what kind of evidence would be required for our military police to lay charges. You do not go around glorifying the virtues of a killer! NOT when you’re the CBC.
The world “betrayal” in this bitch stems from a love of our military, not hate for it.
Conspiracy is not mentioned nor assumed. Dumbassary from the CBC is the issue. jen. I think they ought to be open to public opinion about their reporting.
snap… it’s a pre-post moderated board.
Maybe CBC has a pre-post moderate thinger-ma-thing… I dunno. I don’t go on that website a lot but I had to read a lot about the Haiti earthquake (work-related) so I was on CNN’s website, and some of the things people posted on the articles made you seem like a saint (I say that in the nicest way)
“Just for a minute imagine being the surviving family of the victims seeing this man PRAISED by imagery (a picture speaks 1000 words) for his life’s work in spite of (or as a DIRECT result of) his KILLING these women.
You know and I know what kind of evidence would be required for our military police to lay charges. You do not go around glorifying the virtues of a killer! NOT when you’re the CBC.”
Ummmmm Kay, he hasn’t been convicted of killing anyone yet so lets not jump the gun like in the first paragraph I quoted.
Second, it wasn’t the MPs who laid charges, its the civilian justice system seeing how the alleged offenses are civilian in nature. The OPP is not an arm of the military.
They weren’t praising him, they were simply contrasting his rise in the military to his “secret life”.
It would make a hell of a Dexter episode
Does a judge “jump the gun” by refusing bail or setting bail unusually high for charges like this? Happens all the time yet those criminals are also presumed innocent.
Matt, why aren’t his victims featured in the expose if not to glorify this man and his uniform? The CBC should be reporting on this fool as they did Bernardo… gotta give it to ya on the Dexter comment.
Canada_lover-“Innocent until proven guilty” lol. Tell that to the thousands of people going through “random searches” They’re considered guilty until proven innocent.
Maybe they’re portraying him in his military uniform and with the military because he’s in the military? Or maybe, it’s the only readily available photo(s)?
Holy hell kay . Yea pretty unfortunate we have a system that allows for trials . And the oft mistaken Innocent till proven guilty thing . I think Haiti would be a great place to go for you , I hear there they shoot you in the head and leave you on the sidewalk . For as little as stealing . Saw it on the news . Move there and have fun with that .
damn, beat me to dexter….
he’s obviously not as slick assuming he’s guilty.
though something tells me if he walked in there solemn and depressed as if showing guilt then people would be quicker to jump on him for doing it…
Military families like mine know that when service members are photographed in their professional capacity they are REQUIRED to wear their dress uniforms. Given the accused’s professional position the surprise would be pictures of him wearing anything else! Publishing photos of the accused does not glorify the person Kay, it identifies them. Your take on it seems a little extreme.
Just like anyone accused of serial rapes and killings, this man’s photo is going to be plastered all over the news. It is a shocking accusation concerning a high ranking military officer that is bound to generate as much interest as any of our Canadian high profile murder trials with Olsen, Bernardo & Homolka, Picton, Latimer et al being front and centre in the news until convictions and sentences have been secured.
In this case let’s hope the police have got it right, otherwise there is a serial killer still at large.
Jennier, you are right about that. It is generally the protocal observed by most publications out of respect for the victim’s family and for reasons concerning the trial process.
Yeah, this is not the first story of this type to be closed to commenting on the CBC website. Thankfully there’s LTWWB.
Also, after reading the article, I don’t think it glorifies the accused, but I think they play up his accolades in order to generate contrast with the heinousness of the crimes. The bigger they are the harder they fall and all that.
CBC was wise to close comments on this one, I think. It would just become a clusterfuck of pro and anti-military babbling.
Innocent until proven guilty. Your rant, potentially valid, is a bit early. Let’s wait for this to play out.
Kay,
YES this is indeed a truly horrifying story, but I don’t believe the CBC closed it to commenting for entirely wrong reasons.
For one thing, the guy IS entitled to a trial in the courtroom, with proper procedure, evidence, etc. “Trial by Media” is not good for anyone.
For another thing, the guy held a very prominent position in the military and the community. I mention this because there are probably HUNDREDS of people who know him personally. SOME will want to defend his innocence off the bat, others will want to villify him without mercy BEFORE he is proven guilty. Again, not the best way to ensure an “impartial” trial, if such a thing is possible.
We must never forget that in any murder case, there are some people who don’t care WHO actually did the crime, only that “someone pays.”
There are a few very ugly false conviction cases going through the courts right now for this very reason: where the “obvious” suspect actually didn’t commit the crime, but the victim’s family still wants the guy in jail because it would make them feel better, even though they know it is not right. Sad, yes, but it is a very real side-effect of these most horrible, un-fixable crimes.
Also, the victims’ families have a right to some privacy during what will undoubtedly be a very heated media frenzy.
WHEN the trial is proceeding, when the verdict is returned, and if and when a sentence is passed, THEN I am sure that there will be MANY stories which will allow commenting from the general public.
And you know as well as I do that there will be a FULL range of opinions . . . many of which will be pretty revealing into the nature of the human psyche.
And you can always comment here . . . you are in good form today and I, for one, am glad you’re back.
kay what part of “presumed innocent” don’t you understand. The OPP laid the charges as a result of a joint operation. Each department (OPP & MP) had a piece of the puzzle and worked together to this conclusion (which has not been proven in a court of law).
I suppose now you want to tar the whole CF with the same brush as people have done with the Catholic Church and some of its priests.
While I can appreciate the frustration in this bitch, I have to agree with everyone on the “innocent til proven guilty” concept. And it’s not like Col. Williams was some low-life, under-the-radar loner who kept pigeons in cages outside his window……. he was/is prominent within the military circles and from the sounds of it is good at what he does. The CBC website, I think, is doing what it is supposed to do. Report on the news. And the news in this case, is not only the fact that two women were found dead and two missing, but that the prime suspect is someone who has done so much for his country.
Notice there is nothing in the article that suggests why they consider Col. Williams the suspect. Their suspicions are based on “evidence gathered while questioning people”. What kind of evidence…. did someone say they saw someone in an army getup? Maybe someone anti-military? Or did they actually find something physical linking him? He is up for all the charges due to similarities in the cases. So, if he is not guilty of one, all bets are off on the others.
This whole situation doesn’t even seem right. Sure, killers on TV shows are able to function a la Dexter, in society, within their own families, the workplace. You know, they also brought his neighbor in for questioning as a suspect in the other two cases (non-murder…). He was soon cleared and let go on his way……….
The CBC is guilty of censorship on any story that the public feels strongly about. I just want to see the death penalty brought back to eradicate Canada of these criminal scumbags.
Remember that the CBC has it’s own Legal Department.
There are probably very strict rules at the corporation about how they have to handle stories with both this kind of extreme violence and high-profile suspects.
In very short time, I am sure the coverage will be open for commenting. In the meantime, there are probably procedures they have to follow so that they are not accused of interfering with the processes.
Not a perfect system by any stretch—far from it in my opinion, but I am sure they don’t just decide to close their own stories to commenting just for their own amusment, or to upset the people who want to follow the issue.
Oceanlady, I’m not sure about you but I feel a sense of pride seeing photo’s of our military all dressed up like that. His mugshot would have identified him just fine AND might have even cast him in proper light where the CBC should be concerned.
Do any of you believe for a minute there’s no evidence against this guy? That the charges are laid on a whim? Give your heads a shake.
Ruby, the “heated media frenzy” failed to mention anything about the family other than their girls are victims of this asshat. Think about that for a second.
How would you feel if this photo expose were presented on the day he’s convicted? I’m sure THEN you’d feel glorifying his military service to be quite inappropriate like I do today.
For those of you who think I’m dreaming conspiracy or am slagging military, cops or justice system please just knock it off. My beef is with our public broadcaster.
They don’t arrest “suspects” guessing at what evidence might be required to convict them. They arrest “perpetrators” BECAUSE of the evidence collected. At the very least the CBC can presume that much and paint this guy as the disappointment he is, not the distinguished serviceman shown in those pictures. No mug shot… not a single shot of him out of uniform… even his eyes are open in all those pictures. Imagine being the family seeing that SOB smiling at them from the news story.
Finally, Ruby, “there are probably procedures they have to follow so that they are not accused of interfering with the processes”… yeah, that “procedure” is called FREEDOM OF THE PRESS.
kay, freedom of the press isn’t this blanket thing you get to protect yourself with as you see fit.
Also, you seemed to be confused as to what they (the CBC) can do in this situation. They can only portray him as what he is; a military man accused of multiple murders. If they were to portray him as a guilty man, and he was not, they’re open to a defamation of character suit. That’s why you can only call him the “accused” or say that he “allegedly murdered”.
The family of the victims and the family of accused need to be thought of in this circumstance.
The CBC or any other media outlet and anyone who has a website or anything else (including The Coast) has the right have things in or keep things out within their own organization. Yes, they are allowed to censor themselves. Freedom of the Press means the press (for good or bad) can report things (especially in regards to the government) without fear of reprisal, as long as no libel or slander laws are broken.
BTW kay, I have conducted enough investigations to know what appears to be true at first blush ends up being wrong. Don’t believe me, spend some time in court and listen to something called EVIDENCE. Then look at Marshall, Milgaard, et al.
Oceanlady, I’m not sure about you but I feel a sense of pride seeing photo’s of our military all dressed up like that. His mugshot would have identified him just fine AND might have even cast him in proper light where the CBC should be concerned.
Do any of you believe for a minute there’s no evidence against this guy? That the charges are laid on a whim? Give your heads a shake.
Ruby, the “heated media frenzy” failed to mention anything about the family other than their girls are victims of this asshat. Think about that for a second.
How would you feel if this photo expose were presented on the day he’s convicted? I’m sure THEN you’d feel glorifying his military service to be quite inappropriate like I do today.
For those of you who think I’m dreaming conspiracy or am slagging military, cops or justice system please just knock it off. My beef is with our public broadcaster.
They don’t arrest “suspects” guessing at what evidence might be required to convict them. They arrest “perpetrators” BECAUSE of the evidence collected. At the very least the CBC can presume that much and paint this guy as the disappointment he is, not the distinguished serviceman shown in those pictures. No mug shot… not a single shot of him out of uniform… even his eyes are open in all those pictures. Imagine being the family seeing that SOB smiling at them from the news story.
Finally, Ruby, “there are probably procedures they have to follow so that they are not accused of interfering with the processes”… yeah, that “procedure” is called FREEDOM OF THE PRESS.
Stupidity in it’s finest form . Someone with no knowledge of police or corrections . Talking from the book she read .
I’m not sure what bizarro universe I just woke up in where the CBC could possibly be accused of being favorable to the military. There’s a certain TV reporter whose name sounds sort of like Slob Boredom who is no doubt cursing the Big Spaghetti Monster in the sky that Williams is not still with 12 Wing. Just watching that Atlantic Journalism Award flitting away like a little starling. Fly, fly fly.
And considering the number of times the Ceeb has run the clip of Peter Mackay and the accused, how long will it take the opposition to start asking the honoroble member “What did you know and when did you know it?”
There’s no reason the CBC can’t or shouldn’t portray this man the same way they portrayed Humolka and Bernardo. They should simply portray him as CHARGED for multiple heinous crimes.
hog… do you think copy paste is impressive? I’ll tell you what’s impressive. The impressions people would have of you if you actually wrote what you’ve pasted… save for the last line of CRAP which again draws on your bullshit, sheep-led ESP. Can it for once. There are some good contributions on this thread. Fuck.
I bet you remember every single report about Paul Bernardo from what, 15 years ago? I’m sure he was handled in the same way, at least until the trial started.
I think it sucks that they (the local media) have a local angle to exploit. A few families are going to be put through the ringer on this one.
The most distinguishing thing the press had to report pre-convict Bernardo was that he was a good looking man, which helped LURE HIS VICTIMS and that’s exactly how a responsible press should cover such a story.
Stop digging at me and get back into the bitch if you have anything more to add. Your sheepdom is not only tiring but quite pathetic from a bitch like you, Fever.
Show me an example, other than your “memory” and I might believe you; otherwise, I guess I’ll be a sheep.
Okay “digging” is the wrong word. “nit picking” is more accurate. How does one go about proving a negative anyway?
I don’t know where you were Kay, during the Bernardo trial, but the media in Ontario were publishing anything and everything about Bernardo/Homolka that they could get their hands on including wedding photos, love notes, video etc. As a resident of St Catharines at the time I can tell you that the media circus surrounding that trial brought all the ghoul-seekers out of the woodwork to get their fill of the murder-site in Port Dalhousie. Husband-wife murderers were a unique enough attraction to feed that type of frenzy. A similar dynamic is at play with the accused murderer being a high-ranking military professional. The juxtaposition of such contrasts in one man’s character is bound to be a fascination that the media and the public will feed upon. Get used to it. Everything to do with this accused will be in the media. It is not indicative of glorification even though you choose to see it that way.
Admittedly I was in Alberta subject to A-Channel, CTV and CBC reporting. If the media had presented the pair by touting a list of contributions to their communities then we’d have something to compare.
If that photo expose stood alone without the news story talking about the charge you’d ALL consider it favourable reporting. Please think about that.
No cut and paste isn’t impressive . Its a short cut to having to rewrite your drivel . I have decided your a fat old gay guy in a wheelchair that gets no love . Your attitude reflects it . And as for smart posts – yea lots of em – except for your retorts , they all make sense .
If it makes you feel any better, I just saw a preview of the National showing those same photos whilst playing ominous music.
Gotta get the ratings and have the public watch your news of the hour . Thats what it always is about . Viewership . Not that the story matters . It’s who presents it in the most interesting or morbid way . I thought most would know that anyways . Correct me if i’m wrong .
(finally, a word to the bitch) That’s ANOTHER reason the CBC should have done this differently, hog.
Kay: The media representation of this accused’s military career are in no way ‘touting’ his professional accomplishments. It is just part of the morbid fascination that such evil could exist in one so accomplished.
Was your civilian sense of military pride similarly tarnished when images of Cpl Wilcox in his splendid military uniform appeared in the media prior to and during his trial for killing Cpl Megeney? Both Wilcox and Williams are military members accused of killing seen only in uniform in media images.
Of course the crimes are horrendous, and undoubtedly over the next while many more horrifying details will be made known very quickly.
Back to the original point about today’s story being closed for comments . . . I think it is only a temporary move. I have not checked the Globe or the Herald today, so I have no idea if their coverage of this is open for commenting or not.
In time, I have no doubt that soon enough the commenters will be posting fast and furious as the the story unfolds.
Part of what is so shocking is that no one (ie his friends, colleagues or family) would have ever guessed this guy remotely capable of these things.
I don’t think the horrible crimes are being glorified or celebrated in any way. It’s just that the guy seemed to be, on the surface, to be not only “ordinary”, but exceptionally “good” and “upstanding”—”a pillar of the community” if you will.
I think this IS an interesting part of the whole story (and frankly one that makes the whole thing MORE terrible, in my opinion) but I don’t think closing the comments temporarily means that anything sinister or conspiratorial is happening in the news media.
(I recall a similar policy on some of the news coverage of the woman in Bridgewater who killed her daughter a few years ago.)
You can still write or email the CBC directly (or the Globe and Mail, etc.), or you can phone the As It Happens “talkback” line—they REGULARLY air comments on the stories they run.
It’s not as if they are refusing to COVER the story; I am sure it is only a matter of a few days until the comments are open normally.
AND we must still remember—he may be innocent, he may be guilty, he may or may not be convicted, he may or may not get a “just” sentence . . . or there MAY be other people involved yet to be named or revealed. (ie. He may not have committed ALL the crimes he is now suspected of.)
I wonder what qualities of a serial killer also make him a rising star of an officer? That is to say if he’s guilty.
kill them all, and let god (me) sort em’ out.
I think kay should pay more taxes for being the dumbest Canadian alive. Hit the music.
UGH how many times do people have to repeat themselves for kay to understand a simple point? I’d love to see her in a live debate.
I thought it was a little strange that it was closed to commenting too as they typically only do that for racially charged news items, those involving children or both. The photos didn’t sway my perceptions as to his guilt. If anything I’d say he looked pretty damn intimidating compared to the average joes that enlist. It did strike me as odd that there were so many pictures of him and MacKay our wannabe PM. Mackay’s probably grinding his teeth at the CBC for that subliminal message.
Stoker, I suppose you could argue that post secondary education, A Masters Degree, sound knowledge of mathematics and physics and the visual and spacial acuity necessary to fly fixed wing aircraft, might also be of use to a serial killer/rapist. I presume those are the “rising star of an officer” qualities to which you refer?
I will agree, that if guilty, Williams is going to give criminal profilers and behavioral psychologists ample material for a decade’s worth of academic papers and doctoral theses. I do not believe his career has the slightest thing to do with his alleged “hobby”
Ah, here we go. The photo spread does stand alone. Tell me the CBC is portraying a killer on this page: http://www.cbc.ca/photogallery/canada/3010…
I disagree Ivan, I think his job does have to do with him (maybe) being a serial killer. I’m in no way saying that the military is compiled of serial killers. But pedophiles tend to get jobs as teachers, day care workers, childrens’ sports coaches, and priests… jobs where they are trusted to be alone with children. Necrophiliacs might work at a funeral home or morgue. Zoophiles might work on a farm or at a pet store. These are just examples, and of course lots of the time jobs have nothing to do with it.
But, assuming this guy is guilty, isn’t a job as a high ranking officer ideal for killing people? Most people trust men in uniform. I think it’d be pretty easy for him to get women to trust him. Even if he never thought about which jobs might help his “hobby” before enlisting, it would still help regardless.
They’re photos, kay. PHOTOS. What do you want them to do? Photoshop a pair of devil horns on his head?!
I watch the National last night and it was a different story, it was very critical.
Get over it. You can comment there too and just like every one else that’s commented on the photos, you too can judge him guilty without any knowledge of the facts.
A picture speaks 1000 words. Are they the same critical words you heard on the news last night, Fever? Didn’t think so. My disappointment with the CBC still stands.
I just want to add our tax dollars saw to train this man to be a killer. Ask any new recruit, air force, navy, doesn’t matter… how long before they receive weapons and combat training? For all we know that training is what gave him the self-entitled disposition a rapist surely requires.
There’s no news story along with the photos, so I’ll take them as just that, photos. You seem to think that there’s this massive conspiracy over a bunch of file photos. They’re just that. File photos. He was the Base Commander, so he had his picture taken at many events by the media.
I really thought you weren’t going to make this anti-military, but you have. My tax dollars have trained plenty of men and women to be killers. I’m not losing any sleep over it.
Finally, you’d be surprised how little of your tax dollars go to the CBC. Just because your half a cent of tax dollars go towards them doesn’t mean you get to piss your pant suit over a story with some file photos that’s closed to commenting.
Just because you WANT to see crazy conspiracy in my words doesn’t make it so. I’d like to know what’s anti-military in any of my posts? Especially this one, “Conspiracy is not mentioned nor assumed.” Oh and this one too, “For those of you who think I’m dreaming conspiracy or am slagging military, cops or [the] justice system please just knock it off. My beef is with our public broadcaster.”
When you see the Commander shining his pearly whites is the CBC presenting photo’s of a dangerous predator? When the public sees those photo’s do they conclude the guy’s integrity is in question? NO! They see what I see… a military man we ought to be proud of… and that’s just the first photo “speaking”.
So what if only a few pennies of my tax dollars go to support the CBC? The CBC is our PUBLIC broadcaster and should reflect PUBLIC interests.
And wasn’t LTWWB invented for JUST this sort of thing? You’re an asshole.
And you’re a twat. The CBC is public only in the sense that the government is funding it. If it protected the public “interest”, it would be nothing but a propaganda machine (and some could argue that it is). It would be important to note that you do not constitute 100% of the public opinion, despite how you may feel.
If you don’t like how the CBC is portraying this man, you have every right to look away, or go to another site.
“I just want to add our tax dollars saw to train this man to be a killer. Ask any new recruit, air force, navy, doesn’t matter… how long before they receive weapons and combat training?” That rant is anti-military. You take things out of context, so can I!
My rant about weapons training is a simple fact, not anti-military. I’ll bet you’re all up to date on chem trails too, eh? *snicker*
Fever, “The CBC is public only in the sense that”…. it is to “contribute to shared national consciousness and identity”
Here’s the whole thing:
“…the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, as the national public broadcaster, should provide radio and television services incorporating a wide range of programming that informs, enlightens and entertains;
…the programming provided by the Corporation should:
be predominantly and distinctively Canadian, reflect Canada and its regions to national and regional audiences, while serving the special needs of those regions,
actively contribute to the flow and exchange of cultural expression,
be in English and in French, reflecting the different needs and circumstances of each official language community, including the particular needs and circumstances of English and French linguistic minorities,
strive to be of equivalent quality in English and French,
contribute to shared national consciousness and identity,
be made available throughout Canada by the most appropriate and efficient means and as resources become available for the purpose, and
reflect the multicultural and multiracial nature of Canada.”
Yes, and the CBC fulfills that on a daily basis. It is not included in the mandate that they should portray a man that has been arrested as a killer because kay’s half a cent goes to us.
You make an interesting point Fizz. I’m not sure if I totally agree. Reaching the rank of Colonel takes too much time and effort to simply justify a cover for being a predator. The “Hannibal Lecter” archetype is mostly just a fictional construct; although you do have the occasional Bundy most tend to be like Berkowitz or Picton. Again, a guilty verdict and subsequent psychiatric investigation will be neccessary to settle this issue although you have given me something to think about.
As far the post from the”agreived taxpayer” paying to “train killers” don’t forget, this man was a pilot of transport aircraft. Aside from whatever weapon handling he was exposed to in officer training he spent most of his career in classrooms and cockpits. He would be more comfortable with a laptop than a C-7 rifle. And the flip side of young people in the all-volunteer military of a western democratic nation being “trained to kill’ is that they also get an equivalent amount of training on when not to.
Just because half the population is equipped to be prostitutes doesn’t make them so.
so he’s good with a ‘joystick’…
lock the fucker up.
…if he’s found guilty, absofreakinlutely. I’m not hostile to the notion of holding servicemen to higher moral and ethical standards. That’s one of the reasons why the military is a calling rather than a job On the other hand, to sardonically paraphrase an earlier bit of wisdom, “The world will not be a shittier place if we all work very hard to keep the raping and murdering to a minimum.”
kay did have two clues, but one went missing and the second is looking for the first.
Isn’t it amazing that our military personel are trained to kill. What do you expect them to take into battle, a dozen roses. There have been millions of Canadians who have been through the military, had weapons training, learned to kill and have killed on the battlefield. Out of all those people some have committed murder outside of their job (just as cilivilans have done).
Other than this present situation, only one serving member that I can recall that had committed multiple murder and that was Cpl Denis Lortie at the Quebec Legislature on 8 May 1984.
“sardonically”
wow… nice word Ivan!
This lesson was brought to you by the letters F and U
and the number ∞
Kay: “When you see the Commander shining his pearly whites is the CBC presenting photo’s of a dangerous predator? When the public sees those photo’s do they conclude the guy’s integrity is in question? NO! They see what I see… a military man we ought to be proud of… and that’s just the first photo “speaking”.”
How egocentical of you to assume that a photo of someone inspires that exact same thoughts and feelings in everyone else as it does in you! “Shakes head in amazement and laughs loudly at such audacity” I DON’T see what you see when I see photos of this man. I see a man who has achieved much in his professional life who may or may not also be a psychopathic killer. He’s not the first and likely won’t be the last. Psychopathic individuals exist in all walks of life. You don’t represent public opinion. You don’t represent civilian opinion. You don’t represent military opinion. You represent your own opinion which is your right. Your twist on things is your own view. Why would you even think to speak on behalf of the public?
I get the F & U but the sideways eight really has me baffled. I used the word sardonically because that is the only way I could quote “she whose name must never be spoken” without vomiting blood. I actually take a very strong stance against all things rapey and murdery. It’s something I expect from all Canadian citizens, not just those paid by the taxpayer
Ivan, sideways 8 equals infinity.
Thanks Bro. Filed away and noted for next time. You are right about Lortie. although I think there was also a case in the mid 70’s where a student in an Ottawa High School who was also serving in a militia unit shot some classmates, but the sclerotic memory is a bit hazy.
Ivan, possible but I can’t recall either. Even if it did happen add Lortie, and the Colonel (if convicted), then the number of killers (and trained at that) is virtually non-existent when compared to the number of killers in the civilian population.
If a just conviction is the outcome then this is merely an example that psychopathic depravity exists in all walks of society…no surprises there! Why would the military be exempt?
I’ve been avoiding commentiong on this thread, but am greatly enjoying the conversation. However, one major point nobody seems to have made, that I believe is vital to the original bitch is:
There’s a Publication Ban on this case. Therefore, in accordance with the law, the CBC can’t have the comments open, neither can the Herald, or the Globe, or any other paper as it could cause a bias in the jury pool. This Interwebthingie is quite popular, you know…
Therefore, kay, you should be angry at all national / local publications for having the comments section closed. I think the only reason it’s open here (for now) is bercause they haven’t run a story about it yet…
Having said all that, I could be wrong. Go snip some stuff off some websites to refute while I eat lunch and troll on.
You’ll hear no argument from me on that one Brother Tim.
Oceanlady, I work in marketing. We have a pretty good idea of what you think about images you see. So does the CBC. They speak for you every day.
Gidget. Since we’re talking about it here on thecoast I’m so not sure if any publication ban extends to the running of a public or private broadcaster’s website but thank you for a most interesting point. Let’s hope he selects trial by judge, very common in Canada.
kay, thought you might like this. may explain why you infuriate people….
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100210/od_nm/…
and 1-4 with a little 8 on the annoying list describe my plight.
kay, I thought you were in IT?
Regardless of which type of trial he chooses, kay, there is also the court of public opinion. 😉
Interestingly enough, in high-profile cases, a number of people previously considered “upstanding citizens” choose trial by jury…
Kay: “Oceanlady, I work in marketing. We have a pretty good idea of what you think about images you see. So does the CBC. They speak for you every day.”
The CBC may speak TO me but it will never speak FOR me. And as you’ve switched careers from charity work to marketing I’ll let you in on a little secret > No marketing company has any idea what I think of any images I see. I am not now, nor ever will be part of the status quo. Don’t ewen get me started on what I think of marketing practices and marketing companies. And I still don’t see the same thing YOU see when you view images, in this case, specific to Col. Williams. Why would I? I was raised in a military environment. You are from a civilian background so just like our experiences differ so does the way we view the world. You can imagine that your views are shared by the rest of the world but that does not make it so. I can’t imagine anyone thinking it should be!
Oceanlady you are so wrong. The next thing out of kay’s internet mouth will be “I’m a army/navy/air force brat too”.
It’s not possible to weed through all the nonsense on this thread…but I think it’s a valid point that this suspect is having his “best face” put forward by the media. IF he was a black/Arab/poor/homeless civilian…it’s quite possible that we would be looking photos of him shackled, bedraggled and with a coat over his head, rather than a proud “stock” photo of one of Canada’s “finest”.
Even more disturbing to me was the recent murder of an Ottawa cop by a member of the RCMP…I have read SEVERAL articles that mention only at the end that the suspect is a cop. Had he been anyone else, we would have read all about his drug use, alcoholism, divorces, criminal record, scruffy appearance and on and on and on…
The media needs to suck up to the canadian power structures in order to keep their “inside” pipline open. The first paper to criticise the RCMP finds itself without any “leaked” info, or access to the ‘scoop” etc etc.
The same applies to the armed forces, especially in times of “war”…Don’t bite the hand that feeds you…
media studies 101.
A former mountie who had cysts in his brain. Notice how relevent information changes the story? Yes he killed the cop but he was not in his right mind due to a medical problem.
kay changes her profession based on which job will give her more credibility in the current argument to make up for her lack of actual facts, valid arguments, and coherent thoughts.
The other tactic she likes to exercise is prescribing her opponents identities as younger, less experienced, and “sheep” to discredit their points without having to refute them with actual facts, valid arguments, and coherent thoughts.
So basically, if kay suddenly changes career paths and/or thinks you are a twelve year old boy… you’ve won the argument.
Congratulations
That’s the thing Frosty. It’s one media quip in an endless sea of stories about this guy.
It’s also a series of readily available file photos, taken entirely out of context.
“”A former mountie who had cysts in his brain. Notice how relevent information changes the story? Yes he killed the cop but he was not in his right mind due to a medical problem.”‘
What kind of horsehit is this? “Cysts in his brain’? WTF?
When’s the last time you heard about a biker/black/drug dealer/spouse/ etc etc being ‘pre-excused’ from first degree murder by a mythical “cyst on the brain”??!!
What a stupid fucking opinion Bro Tim…you’ve really outdone yourself here, mate!
And look at you, along with the cop-friendly (wouldn’t dare lose that ‘pipeline’ of scuttlebutt!) media…putting forth a ridiculous excuse for a cop who, this time, actually got caught!
Anyone who premeditatley kills has mental probelms…they’re ALL insane! That’s NO defense IMO…
“Cyst on the brain”…fuck off.
We all can be shown to have ‘problems’ with our bodies if the doctors are sympathetic enough, we have cysts, we have precancers, we have micro-tumors and micro-strokes…It’s down to your legal defense, and what you can afford!! When’s the last time you heard of a successful “cyst on the brain” defense of a poor black man, or a foreign terrorist?
This cock-sucker is just the latest of many power-tripping cops, (for a change): he just got caught. I bet he figured that this dirty Polack cop cost jobs from “Canadians”, including HIMSELF!!!?
I’m waiting to hear the REAL news about this prick…a typical bully RCMP “member”…
Cyst on the brain. Good grief.
“”It’s also a series of readily available file photos, taken entirely out of context.”‘
What do you mean, Dr fever? These days, a “photo” is a google away; stupid argument…
I’m sure that one of the “Marriot” gang has plenty of photos on facebook, or any other public site (where photos are legally free, as per your ‘contract’)…that show them smiling, proud, maybe graduating from school….at a wedding (dressed up) etc etc. But we always see them looking like shit with a coat over their heads; a purposeful trick that the media uses with folks it don’t take a likin’ to!….
…and yet we see this suspect in full glorious dress uniform?
Here’s what it does….it shits on the uniform of the Canadian forces, that’s what it does…and I’m astounded you support it.
If he’s found innocent (he won’t be…watch)…THEN we can show him with his medals on…(the same way we’d show an innocent Marriot in a grad pic, wouldn’t we, lol?)
But I bet we won’t…when this psychopath is found to be a serial killer, the media will drop all mention of the military, and start squawking about all the other negative aspects of his life…you wait and see… “he smoked pot (*gasp*), he watched porno (oh my!!), and he was “never really one of us!”. Bullshit.
IMO, this is the tip of the iceberg….if ALL cops/military/politicians were tested for DNA related to crime (and drugs such as ‘meth’ and crack)…we’d see Pandora’s Box opened for sure!
“Power corrupts, and absolute power currupts, absolutely”….why do we continue to pay lip-service to this trueism when it suits us, but ignore it during our daily existence?!?
I don’t support the death penalty for Canadian civilians…but we need to hold those on whom we have trusted positions of “power” to a higher standard….if he’s convicted, and he will be, you’ll see…
…hang this motherfucking prick from next year’s Boston Xmas tree, says I…
BMF you seem to have a few problems and hate ons. Doesn’t do your credibility any good, just like kay.
I swear you bitches drink some stupid potion every day to keep you ignorant and downright MEAN.
Oceanlady, your military born ESP is failing… again. And one does not need a marketing degree to know images of happy smiling faces solicit a very different reaction from the viewer than sad looking mug shots. You ain’t so special. Not like you think you are, anyway. Imagine that.
Tell me who raises money for charity if not the charities themselves? huh? Every wonder? Tell me it’s anything but a marketing company, you FOOLS. Here, I’ll spell it out for ya. I utilize a long IT career to make money, provide jobs, provide for my respective charities… and NOT work for “the man” for pennies on IQ points. You fuckers.
Bro Tim, only my parents and grandparents can profess such a thing. I opted out just before I got my wings. Please piss off now. You’re not the only military man around and you’re not the only person possessing a sense of pride over our military. How you try to turn every comment into a military bash is very telling about you… and it ain’t a pretty picture. I’m willing to bet the best motivator you have is the disability pension you soak up for all those nasty cysts. And since you’re the epitome of everything wrong in this end of the world I’m willing to bet you drink like a hound with all that free money every chance you get just before driving home. Very attractive. Sure.
Frosty. “‘Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts, absolutely’….why do we continue to pay lip-service to this trueism when it suits us, but ignore it during our daily existence?!?” EXCELLENT. Frosty, you’re the best bitch EVER! Thank you for avoiding the daily stupid potion and all those pesky sheep too!
fizz… it’s that time again. Maybe you should go buy yourself a toy and see if you can’t avoid the cunt-cycle… for once.
What’s glaring here, and you should read right from the top, is the default position of the Nova Scotian. Frosty is OBVIOUSLY not from around here. I’ll be so glad to take my business to a people deserving of the important work I do. The charities do good work but for the likes of you fuckers? Fuck this. Starve. Bleed. Die. Cry. I really don’t give a fuck about improving this place anymore. You don’t deserve it for choosing to remain ignorant and mean!
I think I get it now. You bitches are so absolutely stunned by a truthful, thoughtful person as it’s something you don’t have in your own lives so you deny such people exist no matter what is presented. You spend all your energy looking for fault and malice that you become that which you seek.
Frosty, thank you. See you in Boston.
Baaaaaa, Baaaaaa. Hey Costas, get away from my woolly bum with those clippers….. What the deuce?…. Those aren’t clippers. OH MY SWEET LORD, …NO….. SOMEBODY CALL PETA. BAAAAA, BAAAAA!
I see stupid potion couldn’t be avoided even at this early hour. Addiction is a very sad thing, Ivan, as is bestiality. YUCK
Hopefully some new bitches come out early today.
kay, save your egotistical tripe for somebody who cares, hm? I was wondering when you’d pull out the ol’ Nova Scotians are mean, ignorant, etc. argument. Rinse, Repeat.
Frosty, please take the quote in it’s entire context, not just one passage. What I said was that it’s one little quip in the media (in fact it really didn’t report anything that anyone who pays attention to the news did not know) accompanied by a series of file photos. There’s nothing accusatory or even that defends the accused. Meanwhile, there are thoughtful stories about the case being produced that tell an entirely different story.
He has been charged, so he may indeed be guilty. But let’s reserve that judgment until he’s actually convicted.
I also skewer small babies and do Achmed the Dead Terrorist routines when in my cups. Your Point?
Hey Fever, why don’t we just set him free and book a photo shoot and a special slot of Breakfast TV for him, eh?
There you go again, taking things to an irrational extreme. If you don’t like a particular story, then don’t read it. There are plenty of news outlets that would pander to your “shoot first, ask questions later” demographic.
With the feedback provided on the blog forum the CBC acquires insightful opinion data useful to both news and marketing departments. There are so many good reasons to allow for comment they even spent quite a lot of YOUR money on expensive programmers like ME to create the blog in the first place. Did I mention it’s “pre-moderated”?
All I asked was the CBC, charged to “reflect Canada”, not paint the rapist a hero. Because the CBC is what it is CBC should also open and encourage the discussion. That’s all.
Really, I was just mad I couldn’t write my condolence to the families involved and I really wanted to tell THEM when I thought of the starched collar and pearly whites featured by our CBC.
I’m sure you’ll all get over it. holy fuck
I’m living in Belleville temporarily, and everyone has been looking for Jessica Lloyd for weeks; fliers on storefonts, car windows. It’s shocking, and despite some comments here, he’s plead guilty. They’re in the process of investigating disappearances around other bases he’s tended to. In addition to these women’s grieving families, consider all of the families he’s greeted at CFB Trenton to collect their loved ones remains – imagine losing a daughter overseas and getting condolences from THIS fuck.
I agree.
If I see another photo of this man with Peter Mckay I’m going to lose it – hey, Pete, nice work focusing on the safety of Canadians.
I see both sides here… so I guess I’m team switzerland.
they could have chosen a more appropriate photo given the charges,
but really the photo wasn’t the focus on the article.
it didn’t read… alleged cereal killer happily talks to friends….
anyhoo. I don’t see anyone else contributing anything more since the only people who are going to read this any further are those who are nearly caught up on nearly 100 comments (most of them quite agressive, btw)
Oh I completely forgot about the third kay tactic…
Make another username, and pretend to be someone else who agrees with you to give the illusion that someone besides yourself is actually following your nonsensical exaggerated bullshit argument.
Seriously Kay, the reason this story is so huge is because of his military standing, therefore it’s logical to have pictures of him in uniform. It’s that simple, there is no secret agenda to paint him as a hero. You are reading way too much into this and making a fool of yourself, for the love of god, stop before you hurt yourself.
Yours Truly,
cunt
Send you condolences directly to the family. It’s a lot less contrived and personal than posting an anonymous comment on a CBC board.
Again, you are not the entirety of the Canadian public. You just don’t get that fact, because your narcissism won’t allow you to see past your fingers as you flame every board with your inconsequential ramblings. In Canada, we have laws. Until he has been convicted of the charges under these laws, they need to be neutral.
Frosty… haha they think you’re me. LOL
You poor thing.
That has got to be the worst attempt yet as to what kay other handles are. I have a strong contender, but not quite ready to call her out. And until I find out, her claim about being treated like anyone else with a different handle is bogus. Sorry kay you can’t be the judge and jury on that.
What would I know about how people respond to my posts? Obviously I can’t read so you’re the expert Balls, why not enlighten me? *gag*
I can’t trust you to tell the truth.
that’s not MY problem, Balls. Take Fever’s advice and tell someone who cares. I will tell you no puppet of mine has contributed to this thread. That’s like cheating and I don’t do that.. but you can’t trust that… and I don’t care.
You’ve admitted to having “puppets”… Don’t bring me into this, unless you have a proper rebuttal to my comment.
My contender isn’t in this trend. It is your problem if you’d like anyone to believe that claim. It’s not my onus to prove your claims.
“admitted” okay, if that’s what you want to call it. I call it “avoid dying in a fire” or “avoid being raped with something rusty” or “avoid cokeheads”… and my puppet only speaks when hog shows up. Sue me if you want but thank yourselves for the need for subversion.
“My contender isn’t in this trend.” I wonder if Balls thinks this passes for English? I wonder what Balls thinks I’ve “claimed” other than my opinion. whatever.
zzz, “the photo wasn’t the focus on the article”
The photo was a SPREAD and featured on it’s own on another page (also open to comments). You don’t think I flew off the handle for nuthin’ did ya? I think one photo should have been presented… his mugshot.
Kay-Jan 22/2010” I’m the very same person with the very same opinions and English prowess posting here today. Just because the big red kay doesn’t sit next to my name the bitches simply contribute as bitches should. If that’s not evidence of SHEEP mentality then you tell me what is.”
fair enough. I didn’t see the printed version… just the little pic beside the online article.
Apparently a publication ban means nothing to kay, who is above the law.
“” But let’s reserve that judgment until he’s actually convicted.”‘
Uh-huh.
I agree.
Just like we all do when we see newpaper pics of a black man being led into the court-room in shackles, right? Or an accused drug-dealer with his coat placed over his head? A priest accused of pedophilia? We “reserve judgement” do we?
When a “muslim” colonel in the US forces recently was accused of opeing fire and killing 12 fellow soldiers, you all sat back and presumed innocence THERE as well, did you?
We didn’t hear much of the “good works” that got him up to the rank of colonel…oh no, all we heard about was his “religious position”, his “dangerous acquaintances”, his “poor” attitude etc etc.
Is OUR colonel a “christian”? Are we going to know take a second look at all “christians” in our military? Is someone going to call, as they did in the US, for ALL ‘christians’ to be banned from the military, lol?
“Oceanlady, your military born ESP is failing… again. And one does not need a marketing degree to know images of happy smiling faces solicit a very different reaction from the viewer than sad looking mug shots. You ain’t so special. Not like you think you are, anyway. Imagine that.”
Guess what Kay… according to popular opinion on LTWWB “you ain’t so special. Not like you think you are, anyway. Imagine THAT!” But then again, I’VE never claimed to be special. Different perhaps, but not special.
As for ‘military born ESP’, I don’t even think that exists other than in your fetid imagination. I certainly have never claimed to have whatever that is, never mind supposedly failing at it ‘again’. As for smiling photos of alleged perpetrators eliciting a warm response, did you get a load of all the lovely smiles of Bernardo and wife flashing their pearly whites in video and photo images? I don’t know what your reaction to the images of that ‘delightful’ couple was but mine was one of revulsion. You need to stop imagining that your response to events is (or should be) the same as other people. And, BTW, we are bitchERS, not bitchES. BitchES are submissions from bitchERS. It is a subtle difference perhaps, but knowing the difference decides which side of the english language comprehesion line one stands.
Ocean, don’t you know that kay is a plain bitch with shit for brains.
Frosty, let me introduce you to something called context. It’s a great idea, and could really help you get through your day.
Also, we seem to be forgetting that there is a publication ban, so the press cannot release any photos they have of him in shackles or whatever bullshit you want to see him in. If you don’t like the fact there’s a publication ban, I’m sure there’s a judge out there who will listen to your concerns for a few seconds, then they probably wont give a shit. This happened during the Pickton trial, as well as the Bernardo trial.
Trial by jury, not by some arrogant dumb fuck on the internet.
No offense there, Kay.
But if you bothered to check out the rest of the coverage of this story, the Globe and Mail has also closed commenting on their profile. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/nation…
Also, ever heard of this thing called “context”. Perhaps people would like to know WHERE this guy has been been? How he got to such a high position?
Finally. Can you spell “innocent until proven guilty”… there’s this thing called RIGHTS. We have them in Canada. You wanna go lynch someone withouth a trial, pack your bags dummy.
Do you want to know why commenting gets closed on news sites. Because there are pyschos out there like you.
Jesus lady, fucking think before you type.
As a regular reader of newspapers from across the globe I have noticed that the ‘comments’ section is always closed with stories about homicide until after a conviction has been obtained. This appears to be standard. Not something to whine about.
Thank you BM for pointing out to us the stupidity of stereotyping and making sweeping judgements based on little evidence. Now, go pop some go-pills and incinerate a van full of crip-tards at a toll booth somewhere. 10-4 Good Buddy.
Kay-thulhu, its been said before and better by just about everybody, but in keeping with the season and with all due apologies to the Speverend Rooner, you are a cupid stunt my dear, and always will be.
Omar Khadr. Fuck You. Fuck your dead terrorist father. Fuck your crippled terrorist brother. Fuck your burka-wearing, terrorist cheer-leading mother and sister.
But most of all, fuck you Bruce Wank. You are the one who should be in Gitmo, getting water-boarded and being forced to wear Muriel Dykeworth’s putrified old quinny like a party hat for the rest of your useless life.
Anybody who says that war is never the answer, clearly hasn’t been paying attention to the question.
People have many different opinions about the CBC and about media in general.
People have many different opinions as to whether convicted criminals get appropriate sentences or not.
HOWEVER, I must say that I cannot think of one single instance where a murderer such as Paul Bernardo, Karla Homolka, Clifford Olsen, Robert Pickton, Colin Thatcher, Penny Boudreau etc, has been intentionally “glorified” by any media outlet in Canada—”glorified” meaning “Wow, look, isn’t committing murder just GREAT?”
YES the fact that someone of such high military and community standing seems to have committed horrible, horrible crimes is shocking. YES, before this, he had social and professional connections to other high profile people, with whom he was photographed many times. (And I am sure many of them are keeping their distance now! And keep in mind that THOSE people are in no way connected to the crimes!) And YES he will continue to appear in public and in the courtroom in his uniform, as I understand he is required to do. So, this means we will be seeing a lot of him, and undoubtedly he knows he will be in the media and will conduct himself in the manner he is accustomed.
This in no way means the media is “glorifying” him or trying to praise him for committing the crimes. They are not even glossing over the horrific nature of the crimes he has admitted to, or the ones he is suspected of. They are simply using the photos they have, or are taking photos as events unfold. Showing the man as he actually appears in the moment is not the same as “glorifying” the crimes.
IF, for some reason, the media was falling all over itself trying to excuse him or pretend that he shouldn’t be held accountable BECAUSE of his status, well then that would be a VERY different situation. I don’t see that happening here. He has been charged, he has confessed to some things, it will go to trial as usual, and most media will probably give relatively decent coverage.
I see no evidence (so far) of any censorship or any attempt to “glorify” a man who may be a killer.
Oceanlady, “I see a man who has achieved much in his professional life who may or may not also be a psychopathic killer.”
WHAT exactly in those pictures of pearly whites and perfect uniforms makes you think he might be a “psychopathic killer”? eh? Consider what might cross your mind seeing his mugshot INSTEAD.
Oceanlady, “The CBC may speak TO me but it will never speak FOR me.” I wish that were true but it’s not and is actually at the heart of my bitch. CBC mandate is to “reflect Canada”. These may be my personal opinions but, like or not, I too am a Canadian. I too have a right to be concerned about what the CBC does on our behalf. If I can see the photo expose of the Commander as glorifying a rapist killer or softening the blow of tragedy then others can too. As a Canadian being spoken FOR (to the WORLD) by the CBC I’m concerned people will think ALL Canadians want to pretty up this ugly picture for the sake of our military.
Oceanlady, “You are from a civilian background… You can imagine that your views are shared by the rest of the world but that does not make it so.”
You can imagine your ESP working but that doesn’t make it so.
Oceanlady, “How egocentical of you to assume that a photo of someone inspires that exact same thoughts and feelings… I’VE never claimed to be special. Different perhaps, but not special.”
yeah and 4 out of 5 dentists aren’t talking about you when they recommend you chew Trident. Marketing data doesn’t lie. Smiles solicit smiling responses. Frowns do not. Not rocket science.
Fever, “publication ban” does not inhibit freedom of the press let alone freedom of a business to do what it does, take this very forum as example and understand why it still exists.
Halifamous… Context? WHERE is the mugshot? THAT’S the CORRECT context under these charges. You go talk to Frosty, he’ll straighten you out… maybe. I’ve run out of patience. Finally.
So is the mugshot the ONLY photo that should be shown in a case like this . . . ever?
NOTHING else should be allowed?
As a reader, I think I would want to see a little more than that, to give a complete view of the story. (And of course I would want to read more about the victims, so they are not forgotten, but again this is sometimes more up to the families than the media.)
Dearest Ruby, almost missed ya!. Can’t have that.
“glorified” meaning “Wow, look at what a beautiful person this is and SUCH a distinguished career too!”
Ruby, “he will continue to appear in public and in the courtroom in his uniform, as I understand he is required to do.”
Do you think he’ll show his pearly whites too? If he does he’d better be crying, in my opinion.
Ruby, “This in no way means the media is “glorifying” him or trying to praise him”
WHAT exactly in those pictures of pearly whites and perfect uniforms makes you think he might be a “psychopathic killer”?
Ruby, “Showing the man as he actually appears in the moment is not the same as “glorifying” the crimes.”
What if we do it 12 times? What if we create a special page JUST with the photo’s featured? Are we glorifying him then? I think YES! Imagine what the world thinks of that smile!
kay, a publication ban DOES inhibit the press from discussing or releasing materials in relation to the trial, along with the accused and the victims. This is not the United States. We don’t have a blanketing “freedom of the press”. We don’t allow media circle-jerks like they have in the States, and it’s for the better too.
freedom of expression is guaranteed under the Constitution
Kay,
More than you can ever know, I truly, truly wish that criminals WOULD show more remorse, that there WOULD be photos of murderers crying and showing just how sorry they were for having done these things. I agree that they should suffer, and suffer dearly, for what they have done.
But the sad truth is, many of these people ARE literally psychopaths and sociopaths—they don’t actually feel remorse or regret for the pain they cause, the way normal people do. That is one reason their behaviours are so shocking to those of us who are not capable of doing these things. They seem so unaware WHY their behaviours are wrong.
Non-murdering sociopaths, for example, often rise to positions of great prestige and power for precisely this reason—they hide the worst of it, they mimic socially acceptable behaviors in order to fit in, and they are often praised for being “tough” and “no-nonsense.”
When they do murder, it is often the same pattern, which is why we so frequently see these cases where, really, no one EVER would have guessed that such “good, upstanding” people could be capable of these things. Worse, many sociopaths are said to be genuine “charmers”—which is a skill they have intentionally cultivated precisely so they can get close to their victims.
If I was a family member of one of the victims, I agree I would be sickened by seeing the killer flashing his smile as if all was right in the world.
But another side of me is very glad that this reality is being shown—that killers are not only the people we might be quick to dismiss as “losers” ie someone who just happens to be poor, disheveled, or just plain weird. That a killer can be “hiding” within such a seemingly “normal” person is perhaps one of the most frightening things of all, and it is good for people to be reminded that “you can’t always judge a book by its cover.”
And seriously, now that he has started to confess to some of the crimes, I really doubt we will be seeing many biographical “glamour” layouts that show him ONLY in light of his career achievements.
Although, to be honest, I would be curious to read some kind of biographical “timeline” to see if any clues were revealed earlier in his life.
Cheers!
Freedom of expression is completely different than journalism.
If you feel that strongly about it, you, like Frosty, can talk to a judge, and try to challenge that fact. You wont get too far though.
Yes you have the Right of Expression but that does not mean every media outlet has to give you the opportunity to do so. If the Coast, Herald, CBC do not want to report something, they do not have to.
kaytard if you need to express yourself so bad, get a soaapbox and orate beside Winnie in front of the SGR library.
Kay: What exactly was there in Bernardo and wife’s smiling fairy-tale wedding photos and video that even hinted they were psychopathic murderers? Answer: nothing. The clothing and facial expressions in photos of murderers, accused or convicted, have no bearing on how I feel about the horror of their crimes. The media will always splash the best and most contrasting images of high profile criminals in comparison to media coverage of lower profile criminals because it feeds the media-public symbiotic relationship. Why this should matter to the extent that it does with you is perhaps the better question. In the grand scheme of things who-the-fuck really cares why an accused who serves in the military should ever be portrayed in the media in a professional capacity in their uniform? You have a strange take on things lady, including your version of media glorification. Seeing a perpetrator smile in media images triggers disgust and revulsion in myself and many others. Doesn’t matter how many times the image is viewed. Same reaction. This is a high profile case. There will be extensive media coverage and speculation. Get used to it. The only issue of real and valid importance here is that the perpetrator of these horrible crimes be brought to justice and removed from the general public to prevent more women from being his victims.
Who needs a soapbox when we LTWWB?
Fever, you got me learning about publication bans. I thought I’d never want to know the details but it does extend to the public as well as to the media. The granting of a publication ban acknowledges it fundamentally opposes freedom of expression, which is guaranteed under the Constitution. Judges have convicted over breaching a ban only twice in Canada. As far as I can tell the ban is restricted to reporting on “what they didn’t see” in court until after the trial but this extends to the public as well to those directly involved. Good ol’ Canadians putting an honor system to work again. I LOVE this country for embracing the spirit of the law!
Maybe Tim can offer some wisdom behind the posting of this particular blog, LTWWB, versus the blog allowed on the photo page in question:http://www.cbc.ca/photogallery/canada/3010/ and contrast how they do or don’t challenge or even outright oppose the ban….?
I cite this, actually, it’s probably one of the most useful pdf files I’ve found on the government site.
http://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/pi/pcvi-cpcv/…
Especially focus on this heading: How does a judge decide whether a
non-publication order is appropriate?
It relates to the issue with freedom of expression and especially how a judge considers the issue; “the impact of the proposed order on the freedom of expression of those affected by it.” The judge in question has indeed weighed the effect it would have on the constitutional rights of Canadians. He’s doing his job quite well, I’d have to say.
I implore you to bring this up to a judge and give him your “don’t tread on me” bullshit. Let me know when you’re doing it so I can laugh at you as he tells you to fuck off.
Another thing to add to kay’s resume: Constitutional lawyer.
Fever, think kay will call the judge a sheeple and claim he/she is being hateful/stupid on purpose after kay’s told to fuck off?
i grew up in a town like 40 k’s away from trenton and it was only a matter of time someone got caught doing something very bad in the military; the cops turn a blind eye to base personnel in the just blowing of steam mentality; there’s a local hotel in trenton where you can buy just about any drug from anywhere canada has bases as it is flown in w/ seemily immunity as i’ve never heard of a forces memberbeing nailed for trafficking.
Probably, NGF. The bailiff will have to drag her out as she screams about how we live in a Communist country, and how they can’t “tread on me”, or whatever 1950’s American idiosyncrasy she can think of.
Maybe she’ll tell the judge he/she’s not as special as he/she thinks they are…hehehe.
martym you are completely wrong. There have been many drug busts in the CF just as there are many busts in the civilian world. Go to Young Tower some day and sit in on some Court Martials. They are open to the public just as any civilian court. You want drugs coming into the country? Look at any of the major ports, 200kg of cocaine today.
NGF, nah the bitch would just say the judge is on the take.
kay, I don’t understand why you are so angry over the photo spread of Russell Williams. If anything, it makes the crimes more heinous. Those photos show how far advanced he was in his career, and how highly regarded he was with the military. It’s more shocking to the public that this man could commit those murders. A picture of a greasy haired, unshaven man is something we expect; something we can live with. A picture of a well-dressed man in a uniform, standing with Peter McKay, juxtaposed against a story about him being a murderer is indigestible.
how would it grab you bitches if you knew ANY party involved with the case may request a publication ban? You can presume I’m pretty okay with that unless you think you have ESP and then you can think whatever foolishness you want to. You could even imagine this bitch to be anti-military, anti-justice or anti-Canadian if you wanted to, doesn’t make you right.
sarey, What’s so heinous, damming or shocking about this photo spread? http://www.cbc.ca/photogallery/canada/3010…
One does not have to be a Constitutional lawyer to know or stand up for Constitutional rights in Canada. One just has to care about Canada. Try it.
I agree with Sarey.
I just looked at the photos and while they do have a certain morbid qualitity now that we KNOW what crimes he has been charged with, he certainly wasn’t suspected of any of those things at the various times the images were taken.
Again, we know NOW that he is (allegedly) a horrible monster, but I don’t see anything irresponsible or in violation of the constitution in this collection of images—in my view they give a good overview of how the guy “appeared” to everyone, now obviously in stark contrast to the evil person he REALLY is.
As horrible as we now know him to be, I found the photos to be quite informative and relevant to the unusual nature of case.
Imagine another beloved, high-profile person charged with similar crimes. Say a respected leader, a warm and wonderful musician, a celebrated sports hero. I am sure the coverage would be similar, as in “HERE is the person we THOUGHT we knew . . . but here is what they are believed to have done.” I think it is an important part of the complete story.
but the spread is NOT posted in stark contract to anything! There’s not even a shot of his victims in that spread. What does that tell you? Ruby… the SOB plead GUILTY! Stop screwing around trying to defend him… and note the tag.
“Imagine another beloved, high-profile person charged with similar crimes”
Michael Jackson. Was he featured singing and dancing in a stand-alone photo spread of his remarkable life on the CBC or was he shown dangling his baby from a balcony 1000 times over? Ah, but MJ wasn’t Canadian and MJ wasn’t associated with our beloved military. Do the math as you follow the money and you might find yourself a little more Canadian today than you were yesterday.
Do you bite the hand that feeds? Not likely. Neither does the CBC.
“contract”, “contrast”…. whoops.
Kay, if you had a child (heaven forbid) and they were killed, would you want their photo on the same page as their killer?
I wouldn’t.
“follow the money”? A little too much Fox news I would say.
No of course not but the point certainly debunks the “heinousness” Ruby thought s/he saw in the spread.
“Follow the money”.. not a principal reserved just for Fox newscasters. Try it. You’ll be surprised at all the motives the CBC has to stay in “good standing” specifically with our military.
I don’t like the guy anymore than you do.
Personally, I find it quite unsettling to see this guy doing all that “community work” with dignitaries and then think about what he has done. I can’t say that those photos haven’t made me think A LOT about how little we really know about crime and human nature. I am glad that I know a bit more about him now—I think his evil is only magnified by all this.
In time, we will be hearing MUCH more about the victims and what happened to them—remember that a LOT of old cases are being opened up again, but he may not be connected to all of them, and so there will be a need to keep some separation between all the investigations.
That coverage will also be extremely important but I personally find it very hard to read. Keep in mind that the families themselves often want that kind of information to be somewhat contained, so not all the decisions are in the hands of the media. (I worked on a similar story for a magazine a few years back and we had access to all kinds of info about the killer (public domain) but the girl’s family insisted on no media contact/photo publication of any kind, so we had to respect that.)
Yes, the murderer IS the one who has violated the sacred rights of other human beings, the victims and the families—NO dispute there. But that cannot be undone by not telling this very important aspect of the story.
And I do not feel that any other rights—mine or the families—have been violated thus far by the media coverage, and I do not think the photos represent any kind of conspiracy protect the guilty party or to intentionally distort the news.
wasn’t the original pic released when he was charged?
you can’t seriously say you want someone not convicted to have a mugshot every time?
if I charged you with fucking seabiscuit, despite the fact that you’re innocent (presumably…?)
, you certainly wouldn’t want your mugshot on that story…
Once he confessed though, let the shit-clouds open up and have the whole Shitticane rain down on him… mugshot and all.
Oh yeah, Kay, the CBC was totally in bed during Somalia…
kay: “Marketing data doesn’t lie.”
Wow, where do I start? As someone supposedly *in* marketing, you of all people should know that marketing data is often based on skewed facts. Therefore, it dies *indeed* lie.
As someone who was responsible in the past for skewing said facts for marketing companies, I know better than alot of people that you can take statistics and skew them to fit any marketing plan a company has.
That whole 4 out of 5 dentists thing? Take 100 dentists. 4 of them recommend a product. They’re all blonde. Pick a 5th blonde dentist out of the 100 surveyed who *doesn’t* recommend it. Voila. Even though the *actual* number is 4 out of 100, legally you’re allowed to say “4 out of 5”, which gives a whole different bent to your marketing campaign, doesn’t it?
How do you think McCrap’s can say they use “100% beef”? Because the beef they use *is* 100% beef, but they just don’t make their entire patty out of it.
As for the whole “anyone can request a Publication Ban” thing – ever think there’s a reason for that?
If your child were molested by someone, would you want her name and photo to be put in the paper? What if the molester was a close family friend whose photo and name could easily be linked to your child whose identity you wanted protected? You’d want one then, right?
But what if the accused’s parents applied for one, and your child *wanted* to tell the world so she could go around speaking at schools to help other children come forward?
See, like everything, there is more than one option, just like there is more than one opinion, and being respectful of other peoples’ opinions *should* be part of a spirited discussion, a fact which many of us could use a refresher on.
kay:
“There’s not even a shot of his victims in that spread.”
Um, not at the top of the article, but there *are* photos of them if you scrolled down and read the entire story, but seeing as how you missed the line about the Publication Ban, which is RIGHT NEXT TO the victims’ photos, I wouldn’t expect you noticed.
Also, we don’t KNOW that they’re “his” victims yet.
Just in case I wasn’t clear before . . .
I am NOT defending the man who committed the crimes, I am defending the CBC’s choice to show us the photos of all the things the man was doing in public while committing heinous crimes “in his spare time.”
“Accused criminal” vs “CBC showing life events of accused criminal.” Big difference.
Likewise, Peter MacKay et al are NOT accomplices in these crimes. I am 100% certain that the dignitaries at the events DID NOT KNOW that the “upstanding” man they were with was secretly a serial killer.
*grabs popcorn*
I LOVE watching kay talk out of her ass then defend it until she is blue in the face. 🙂
MJ was not a psychopathic killer! MJ was not convicted of anything. Perhaps hali makes a more valid statement.
kay, I know the photo spread of which you speak, and I specifically spelled out why I thought it made his crimes more heinous. The stark contrast comes when you actually read the captions that go along with the photos. “Col. Russell Williams, 46, is seen at Canadian Forces Base Trenton on Jan. 17, 2010, during the deployment of the disaster assistance team to Haiti. Williams, commander of one of Canada’s busiest air force bases, 8 Wing CFB Trenton, has been charged with first-degree murder in the deaths of Jessica Lloyd, 27, and Cpl. Marie-France Comeau, 38.” Additionally, the caption at the top throughout the photo shoot is “Col. Russell Williams, Charged in 2 women’s killings.”
You also have this weird conspiracy theory that the Canadian Military is somehow involved with the CBC news story. If anything, the military wants to distance themselves away from this man. They would probably love nothing better than to not have pictures of him in full dress uniform, posing with the likes of Hillier and McKay splashed all across CBC. Instead, it’s getting rubbed in their faces that a high-ranking official is actually an accused killer; the photo spread is a condemnation of the Canadian Armed Forces, not a glorification of it.
For someone in ‘marketing’, you seem to have a skewed vision of the Canadian public and the effects of media. Guess what? We think he’s guilty!
sarey…it has been reported that while being questioned as a suspect Williams confessed and was the one who led police to the latest victim’s body. Since he is pleading guilty there won’t be a trial. It will be court ordered psychological evaluations and a sentencing hearing. Because it involves more than one homicide there will be no chance of parole before 25 years. If Williams is declared a dangerous offender, which is likely, he will never be released.
Thanks Oceanlady. Change that last comment to “we KNOW he’s guilty!”
kay’s posts are like listening that drunk annoying bitch at a party who gets trashed, says every song is about her and then she passes out and/or breaks something. oh, and probably shits herself.
I KNOW HER!! she’s the loud one with the hair… who throws up on you while you’re chatting on the floor in the corner.
or is there more than one?
I’m confused.
It was also reported that Dewey beat Truman.
Case closed.
guilty as charged.
apologies accepted.
thread unbookmarked.