We can debate whether crime rates are going up or down, nevertheless it’s important to send a message to the general public that serious crimes, hurting people, won’t be tolerated. I think that is something we can all agree with.
If that is the intention of the Conservative’s Omnibus bill currently before parliament however, it isn’t clear to me.
Why would someone growing six marijuana plants get more time in jail than someone who has raped a child? Seriously?
Is that supposed to show how important our children are to this conservative government? If so their priorities are seriously out of line.
Why aren’t we focusing instead on crimes in which there is actual demonstrated harm inflicted on people?
It seems to me that the majority of Canadians have voted for a 1984 inspired police state regime, not a “tough on crime” agenda.
The astounding arrogance and ignorance portrayed by Federal conservatives seems to preclude reasoned, fact based debate on these important issues.
Every last Federal conservative MP should be ashamed of themselves. Their blatant disregard for children by placing growing a plant higher on the offense scale than raping a child is disgusting and disturbing. —A Canadian
This article appears in Sep 29 – Oct 5, 2011.
http://lisamorguess.files.wordpress.com/20…
it is a sad state of affairs op. human life has no value, i guess. those damn dirty pot smokers are ruining the world^^ http://www.cannabissativa.com/wp-content/u…
Yeah wtf is with the lax laws on sex offenders. They’re like the highest likelihood to re offend aren’t they? Fuck this government. Anyone who voted PC can suck my dick while I’m shitting.
o.p., unless you are some sort of felon, i wouldn’t worry much about this bill. it will go the way of all other bullshit the cons have given out over the last ten years or so. this will only affect you, if you are commiting a crime. so again, don’t sweat it.
tommy, would you really want them to do that, man, i think better of old john wang, than that.
I guess I’m just not comfortable with diversity Tommy, but I’m gonna have to pass on that. >; )
If you wouldn’t worry about these _bills
_ Life Sucks, you are a moron. Oh sorry, if I’m doing nothing wrong I have no reason to worry, right? Yeah, my Canada is all about police and government officials spying on me, entering my home via my computer, without a warrant, and punishing pot smokers more harshly than child rapists. You are a sick fuck just like these conservative MPs.
You should worry about this bill. Contrary to what Harper believes, incarcerating people for petty crimes like growing a couple plants or something minor does not make things better. The only thing it does is increase the prison population!
To see a clear case of what happens when you jail everyone, just look south the USA. They have a huge prison population. People arrested and jailed for minor possession of weed (which should be legalized, taxed and regulated like alcohol). Instead of spending up to $50,000/year on housing, feeding and just keeping these people behind bars, why shouldn’t the gov put that money into training & education? More education & training never hurt anyone.
So if you think this bill won’t have any affect on you, you’re wrong. Just watch your taxes go up, federal deficit go up, and of course, cut backs on social programs, benefits and whatnot. Don’t forget how many billions have been spent on security since 9/11. You know Canada is a haven for terrorists and all that money spent has made you so much safer! Look at all the terrorists they’ve caught and how much cheaper your flights have become. Flying is less of a hassle and so are border crossings now!
I’ll tell you the same thing sux, when your grand-daughter is raped and the douche only gets a slap on the wrist.
I know I’m not a bad driver in bad weather…
it’s the other idiots that are gonna hit me that I’m worried about.
lol nah you know what.. I’m no political expert by any means. People are entitled to their political affiliations. The other parties weren’t up to the task. PC was probably the lesser of the 3 evils.
It just enrages me as a socially responsible, employed, tax paying pot smoker that a small grower is getting more time than a scumbag kiddie diddler. Prohibition doesn’t fucking work, we learned this almost a hundred years ago. And we need tougher laws on sex offenders. I couldn’t imagine if I had a child and someone abused him/her that the perp only does minimal time. If someone ever laid a hand on one of my little cousins…
Conservatives just piss me off.
OP, the child raper is supposed to get more time in jail, but his sentences were determined by Liberal bills. If we give the Conservatives enough time, I’m sure the will rectify the problem.
Most Conservatives I know would gladly see sex offenders subjected to the most barbaric punishments an Islamic judge or Apache war party could dream up. No restorative justice or possiblilty for rehabilitation there. Some things just come off the assembly line broken. Do you think I get a warm fuzzy “Just Society” feeling in my heart knowing that I helped pay Clifford Olson to tell the truth, or for Karla Homolka’s Soc. degree. Not friggin’ hardly.
But I am getting tired of the “6 plants for personal consumption” argument. It seems like the same overblown hypothetical questions that people haul out of the closet when debating things like capital Punishment or Abortion. “What about Clifford Olson?” “What about children of rape or incest”
How common are these things likely to be? The fact is that however benign marijuana use may be, however responsible the recreational users are, the vast majority of it is sold by and used to fund organized crime. Just like every other illegal drug. So ,no, I don’t fear the guy with six plants, or the person who grows for his select group of friends/customers. But it is the scumbags making big bucks off it that are a clear and present danger to our society. And if Mr. Personal Consumption is growing enough to be on the radar of the police; he’s probably also on the radar of the people whose business he’s cutting into. Guess which side is likely to violate his civil and human rights to the greater degree.
Answers? – Got none. Decriminalize marijuana – O.C. will just diversify.
Are more laws necessary to take away some people’s rights in the name of greater safety for all?. Ask a law-abiding gun owner.
Feck, I need a beer. Brain hurty now.
Yup, congrats to all you fucking retards that voted this piece of shit into a majority government. This is just the beginning, wait untill he starts attacking our civil liberties. He also wants to make it legal for police to randomly pull people over to check for DUI, this basically means that this opens the door for police to search you and your vehicle with no reasonable cause. If you want a disturbing read, check out “The Armageddon Factor”, I can’t remember the authors name but he is an investigative journalist. It will open your eyes to what is really taking hold of our government.
You think decriminalization won’t work? Would you rather the government jail people and spend billions on that or would you rather regulate it and tax it and use the money to fund secondary education, social programs and whatnot?
Prime example is south of the border. Look at the mess their prison population is. Alcohol kills more people every year than weed does, so why not legalize it? Heck, if you’re worried about harder drugs, decriminalize it as well. What’s OC going to do then?
Read the following articles if you think that decriminalization won’t work.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.…
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,…
http://healthland.time.com/2010/11/23/port…
The war on drugs, just like the war on terrorism is a sham. One big farce that is not only a failed one, but a waste of money. Use that money on better policing. More cops on the streets, walking the beat!
Go sell your warmed-over Chomsky at some other commune, Truther. We’re all full up with crazy here. I’d love to see more cops on the street, but guess which pack of cupid stunts would be crying about profiling, excessive force and that onmipresent Orwellian Police state. You got it, hippy.
more bike cops!! http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_GJz3bPFtDhc/TU_G…
That’s just it, OP, the ‘majority of canadians’ DIDN’T vote this current government in because only 39.6% of the votes went to Harper’s government.
And that’s just out of those who voted — only 61.4% of eligible voters turned out.
So only roughly 40% of the 60% eligible voted for the Cons. 40% of 60% is 24%, so, (if my calculations are correct) wouldn’t that mean only 24% of Canadians (eligible to vote) voted for Stevie?
Doesn’t sound like the majority of Canadians to me!
FUCK I hate it when people bitch “canadians” out for voting in the government they voted in. Half the time these people didn’t even go out and vote themselves!
Just STFU already and wait till the next election. It’s not like you can DO anything. You’re just wasting your time and energy. If you feel so strongly about this, join a political party and campaign against the Cons in the next election. FFS.
Its funny how the same people that say “we don’t need firearms, the government/police will protect us” are often the same people that say “The system is gonna screw us out of our civil rights, starting with the right to smoke marijuana”
All the more reason to legalize Ivan. Such is politics. Sometimes the right thing to do trumps public opinion.
My main reason for wanting it legalized is keeping it out of schools and out of kids’ hands. Sure kids would still smoke it, like kids still drink and smoke cigarettes under age, but it wouldn’t be everywhere the way it is now. This doesn’t just affect smokers, this is our kids we’re talking about. These laws put drugs in kids hands. I know kids who were smoking joints in elementary school, selling it in Jr. High.
Prohibition doesn’t work.
In the eyes of the law, possession of 5 marijuana plants is the same as possession of child porn or touching minors (>=6 months). Possession of more than 200 marijuana plants is the same as sexual assaulting a minor (>=1 year). That’s pretty fucked up.
And whether or not you engage in this sort of behaviour, the amendments matter. Enforcement and imprisonment costs are going to skyrocket and that’s going to affect the amount of taxes you pay.
I’m not sure how SCC rulings work, or even if this bill would make it to the SCC. If so, hopefully it gets overturned like the fed’s position on Vancouver’s Safe Injection site did.
“That’s just it, OP, the ‘majority of canadians’ DIDN’T vote this current government in because only 39.6% of the votes went to Harper’s government.”
And AN EVEN LARGER MAJORITY OF CANADIANS DIDNT VOTE FOR THE OTHER ASSHATS
“Alcohol kills more people every year than weed does,”
alcohol kills more people the first day of every year than all the ‘weed deaths’ in all of history. because you can readily measure and verify if someone is drunk without having to do anything physically to the person… is why it’s semi-permitted.
if we could breathe into a device which tells us the level of stonedness, it’d be taxed and sold as well.
because they don’t have those non-invasive, nearly-instantly-reported-and-accurate tests, they have no choice but to give a sweeping yes or a sweeping no.
since driving whilst stoned is probably not the best idea…. they went with no and it’s been fucked over ever since.
Ivan,
Did you even read the articles I posted? There’s nothing socialist or communist about it. It’s called fact over fiction.
Would you rather pour billions into a useless war on drugs or would you rather the gov spent that money on treatment programs (which cost way less), and dedicate police resources to violent crimes instead of undercover sting operations to arrest someone who’s growing for personal consumption?
Having more police on the street, walking the beat does not mean more of a police state. It means getting them out of the office, and cars and doing police work! You know, instead of sitting in the Tim Horton’s parking lots or BLIP parking lots doing nothing but waiting for a call to come in. Why not have them walking various neighbourhoods instead. That will keep the hoodlums from assaulting people and make our city safer.
LV, we don’t need firearms. And yes, the government & police should be protecting us. They are civil servants and work for us, the people. However, their job is to serve & protect us. Not to incarcerate and monitor us according to their whims. They answer to us, we don’t answer to them.
All drugs should be decriminalized and efforts should be redirected toward treatment. From a fiscal stand point, this is cost effective: fewer addicts, fewer people to house in jails, and more productive tax paying citizens.
Case in point: in the early 2000s Portugal decriminalized cocaine, heroine, marijuana and some other drugs in favor of treatment programs. A few years later they observed a drop in overdose-related deaths and HIV rates.
OB, then don’t commit any crimes and you’ll be fine. The honest, law-abiding citizens of this country aren’t worrying about the bill, we just want those criminals punished and behind bars. The only thing missing is the death penalty.
With all the economic turmoil right now, you would think the government would be looking for new ways to raise money, create industry and jobs as well as diversify their tax structure. It has been said that the revenue in BC for the pot industry is around 10 billion a year, and that’s only one province. Most likely a great majority of that money sits in peoples mattresses, never to re-enter the system again, and that’s not counting the money that leaves the country and sits in some drug cartels cash bunker never to be taxed or enter the system again, when organized crime trades their pot profits for cocaine.
We actually have an opportunity to be progressive in our policies, not regressive. We should be legalizing, taxing, and enjoying all the new businesses, jobs and industry that can be created by that squashing of an archaic way of thinking. On top of all that, we take the money and power out of the hands of criminals and put it to good use in an overextended economy.
Instead what do we do, we give long prison sentences, spend recklessly on prevention, prosecuting, and retaining all these people the government would like us to believe are dangerous criminals. Another stupid waste of money and time, but this is what I have come to expect from a government that has lost touch with reality and it’s constituents.
You’re right. I didn’t >: ( I was too busy applying electroshock to the 3rd world orphans making non-fair trade landmines in my sweatshop. I suppose I figured it was more leftie drivel like the tripe you posted about Toronto. Mea culpa
It would be interesting to see if the Portuguese model is transferable to North America. It would also be interesting to see some stats on ordinary street crime in Portugal during that same period (muggings, robberies, B&E) Because that’s what fucking junkies are – criminals. A goddamned disease infecting society and preying on those who actually work for what they desire. So, prior to deciding that they wanted society’s help, how many law abiding citizens did Portugal’s drug maggots victimize? And I still maintain that putting more beat cops in high crime areas (because it doesn’t make sense to put them in low crime ares, right) would provoke the most hysterical reaction you can imagine from all the usual suspects. If the example of Toronto is anything to go by, and I’m talking ordinary quality of life crimes, not the Anarchist Olympics, the single biggest obstacle to law enforcement are municipal politicians and grass-roots “community activists”
Don’t blame me, I voted for Kodos.
Sounds like a great idea to me, decimating the middle class by throwing 15% of the country in jail for smoking pot. That will be great for the deficit! Brave new World!
“The honest, law-abiding citizens of this country aren’t worrying about the bill, we just want those criminals punished and behind bars.”
So you’ll feel safer when all of the “criminals”, potheads, are serving more time than baby fuckers.
So you honestly think those crimes are on par…….
Wow.
“Because that’s what fucking junkies are – criminals.”
Are pot heads junkies now? lol. Missed that memo. Sorry that the $30K I pay a year in taxes for this socialist nanny state isn’t enough to allow me to grow a few marijuana plants or smoke a few joints. Fucking fascists.
I’m not talking about people who work jobs, contribute to society and enjoy blazing up from time to time. I’m talking the pieces of human shit that are so hooked on narcotics that they NEED government help (read: taxpayer’s help – see Porgtuese example above) to get off of the garbage and until they do, they rob, steal and defile to support their goddamned filthy habit. And the equally filthy pieces of human shit that deal to them. And don’t think I’m playing favorites here. Throw drunk drivers into the mix as well.
Yeah, I know – I’m arguing from emotion, not fact. But Jesus Fuck this bullshit pisses me off. Reward the scum and penalize the law-abiding. We’ve lost it.
ivan knows many bitches who blaze up and he likes them just fine http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivation…
PK, if people didn’t go out and vote and don’t like the present government, it’s their own damn fault.
I vote. I’ve voted every goddamn time I’ve had an opportunity, which in this piece of shit country isn’t very often (or perhaps it is very , but also often meaningless).
Let me know when I can vote for judges, supreme court or otherwise, and police chiefs and comptrollers.
It’s pretty bad when “conservatives” spend like drunken sailors, more so than the “hippies” some of you are so off about. How hypocritical.
And now we get to spend billions and billions more jailing fucking pot smokers – like me – who contribute to society through taxes, who have careers, who vote, who _don’t hurt people_!!
♥Mouse Ears♥ to Orgasmatron & Paingirl. Apologies to all others except the 2 gutless motherfuck junkie cocksuckers who robbed my wife 8 years ago.
But yeah, since I smoke pot, I create the same societal harm in my living room as some babyfucker does. Great. Good work guys.
yikes, that’s nasty admiral…grrooo
I agree BT!!!!
Next time someone’s whining about the Con gov’t, ask them if they even voted. You’ve got a 2 in 5 chance that they didn’t! 😛
Here’s a little something to put in your pipe & smoke:
Have you heard of the Partnership for a Drug Free America? It is funded by pharmaceuticals, alcohol and tobacco companies.
California came very close to legalizing marijuana last November. It did not pass, because of a huge lobbying effort by PDFA. Now ask yourself why an alcohol company would want marijuana prohibited?
I am not supporting terrorists with my little vice (the only one I have left!) It is grown within 50 miles of me, and I know the growers-regular guys, not jihadists. (also, btw, WAY better than even the finest stuff I smoked in Hali. I scored some ‘high grade’ a few weeks before I left Halifax, but it still wasn’t as good as the hilltown’s homegrown)
Also consider the superprisons we have in the US, where they are (in the south) and who profits by them.
So, instead of helping people overcome their addictions, so that they can become productive citizens (have a job, pay taxes, etc..), let’s just throw them into jail. Yeah, that way they just sit there, being unproductive. Gee, let’s not spend $5000 helping them get better. Instead, let’s spend $50,000/year holding them behind bars for their entire sentence. Yeah, that makes lots of sense!
Sorry about your wife, and those criminals should have been punished. Not for being junkies. But for robbery. They could have been high on aerosols or even drunks for all we know. Addiction is a medical issue in which we need to treat people for. Not incarcerate them. Once their sentence is done, they will just go back to their old ways. With treatment, they will overcome their addictions. Prime example, Portugal.
How do we treat diseases currently? We use treatment. Prescribe medications, rehabilitation, physiotherapy, etc.. We don’t just amputate a limb. Sounds like with your model, we’d just amputate everything before we even try to treat it. Got cancer? Oh, too bad..no chemo for you. We’ll just take you behind the shed and put a bullet in your head.
The drivel I posted about Toronto was not leftist. I cited The Star, CBC, The National Post, and The Globe & Mail. I could have cited more, but felt that I had left, right & center covered. Try watching the documentary, it’s quite interesting. Stop letting your emotions get the best of things and start using facts to back up policies.
The crowd that go on about spending $50K a year to jail ’em – simple solution, hang them, harvest the organs and sell them = sounds fine to me.
Sorry, the numbers are actually higher. From http://www.vcn.bc.ca/august10/politics/fac…
The Costs of Incarceration
Correctional services expenditures totalled almost $3 billion in 2005/6, up 2% from the previous year.
Custodial services (prisons) accounted for the largest proportion (71%) of the expenditures, followed by community supervision services (14%), headquarters and central services (14%), and National Parole Board and provincial parole boards (2%).
This figure does not include policing or court costs which bring the total expenditures up to more than $10 billion for the year.
Cost of incarcerating a Federal prisoner (2004/5): $259.05 per prisoner/per day
Cost of incarcerating a Federal female prisoner (2004/5): $150,000-$250,000 per prisoner/per year
Cost of incarcerating a Federal male prisoner (2004/5): $87,665 per prisoner/per year
Cost of incarcerating a provincial prisoner (2004/5): $141.78: per prisoner/per day
The cost of alternatives such as probation, bail supervision and community supervision range from $5-$25/day.
So, tell me, what do you think will happen to the taxes you pay, the funding various social programs receive, funding for education, healthcare, and basically your quality of life after so many more people are imprisoned for longer sentences for minor violations?
Gotta love your new Omnibus Crime Bill. Get tough on crime even though crime rates have fallen across the board for years now. You know, keep on continuing with the war on drugs, war on terrorism, war on crime, war on freedom, ….war on .
I’ll take it under advisement. I’m still waiting for the Royal Commission to determine the causes of the “real” civil rights violations in Toronto – those people who had their property destroyed, their livelihoods ruined and their insurance premiums sent through the roof. I have a fuck of lot more sympathy for them, than I do for someone who had to spend the weekend in a chickenwire cage because their ego led them to be where any moron could have predicted a riot was going to break out.
And I’ll say it again, the notion of rewarding asocial scum by penalizing those who have tried their damnedest to live by society’s rules gives me one big fucking migraine. As far as emotion goes, it’s one of the few things I have left so I’ll continue to indulge myself. As far as policy goes, I probably wouldn’t want to live in a country run according to my principles and prejudices, but that doesn’t for one moment mean that I want to live according to yours.
You obviously didn’t read any of the articles I posted. Here’s one in case you’re not aware of the major violations of charter rights that took place:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/natio…
It should never be acceptable that the police can randomly stop anyone on the street and demand identification. You do not have to identify yourself. They stopped people who weren’t even near the demonstrations and demanded identification. If you didn’t, they arrested you. As you can see, a clear case of abuse and violation of charter rights. Not only that, but the legislation was done in secret, behind closed doors.
You find all that acceptable? How do you explain the TTC worker who was arrested on his way to work, in full work uniform? Or people arrested for walking home or running chores? Or those who were caught between police & protestors when the protests changed routes?
Don’t worry, soon there will be warrantless searches, phone taps, and internet monitoring to keep you safe. You know, since you were a moron to accept their accept their argument and because you’re not doing anything illegal, you won’t have anything to worry about. You’re not one of them terrorist pot smoking junkies. Those diseased junkies are all safely locked up behind bars.
that whole g20 fiasco was the clusterfuck of clusterfucks… skype next time. those who burn and destroy are jackwads
Ivan, can you help me out? I’m confused. What do you mean by
“Reward the scum and penalize the law-abiding.”
In the context of this argument?
Pork Pie you sound like a fascist pig. Go live in Nigeria or Columbia or Taiwan and see how you like it. We haven’t had a death penalty in a long time because the majority of us don’t support it. Hanging people for using drugs? Harvesting their organs? I don’t want a heroin addict’s liver!
You really don’t contribute much of anything useful to any conversation I’ve ever seen you take part in.
i like living in a country, that when i hear planes and helicopters, i don’t run for cover
Yeah, I’ll accept it as a”gross violation of rights” when they discover mass graves in Scarborough, when we see mothers of Los Desaparecidos gathering once a week in front of that big Toilet Bowl in downtown Toronto, when those who were arrested come back after 20 years “Corrective Labor” mining uranium in Northern Ontario on a cup of boiled wheat per day. Until then, the worst that it will be is a clumsy over-reaction to a chaotic situation that NEVER should have occurred. Because that’s what a riot is, and by it’s very nature the response will not be surgical, it will in fact be heavy-handed. Which is exactly what the scumbags who caused the riot counted on, and I’m more than willing to bet that many of those arrested, like that stupid cunt with her bubbles, deliberately put themselves in the position to be victims in order to create this appearance of a a heavy handed overreation and the violation of rights. Those who caused the riot and those who profited from it will probably never answer for it. Certainly not to the satisfaction of those who lost most. And I don’t mean those who had to use a porta potty in a plywood cell in front of a bunch of other people.
Tommy, right now we sentence criminals, addicts, junkies, gutless cocksuckers who rob women and the elderly for the sake of shoving shit into their veins or up their noses to a certain period of time where food, shelter and clothing is provided gratis. They aren’t “sick”. They aren’t “victims”. Society has not “failed” them. I’m not claiming that incarceration is any kind of fun, but there are any number of people in the country who have done NOTHING wrong, harmed NOBODY and can’t count on those sorts of things. With the Portuguese example, we would pay to give these fuckers free rehab, medicine and education – again things that people who have never committed any crime have to work bloody hard to attain. Maybe that’s the workable option. Maybe that’s the most cost effective way. Maybe society would be better off for it.
But the principle behind it sucks cock. Nothing’s going to kill off the middle class quicker than propagating the notion that the working taxpayer is a sucker and a bitch who deserves to get fucked over. And that’s been going on in this country for a fuck of a lot longer than Harper has been in office.
PHILOSOPHY TO THE RESCUE! WHAT IS JUSTICE?
“jus’tice, n. Just conduct; fairness; exercise of authority in maintenance of right; reward of virtue and punishment of vice.” The Concise Oxford Dictionary.
What is required here is to raise the level of debate as to what constitutes justice above that of claim and counter-claim to the level of philosophy, that is, to the level of the ideological presuppositions which undergird each position. Ultimately, of course, one’s take on the nature of justice arises as a consequence of one’s position in respect to the primacy of society (the group) or, on the other hand, the primacy of the individual. Both positions have merit, but both also have their excesses.
For those who place primacy on the group the path is clear. Those who violate the well-ordered functioning of the social group deserve the full punishment of the law, up to and including capital punishment. This is the classical (i.e. Greek ) view in which the citizen, quite literally, had no identity outside his “polis” or city-state. That is why banishment was equivalent to death. The view encapsulates an “organic” conception of society in which mutual responsibiliy to the civic “other” is paramount.
In recent times, however, we see the rise of individualism, a view in which one did not derive one’s identity from the group but rather from one’s inherent humanity. The view, no doubt, originatd from the Christian concept of the “soul,” that which indelibly marked the individual as a unique creature created in God’s image. This view, of course, has survived in the ideology of liberalism and is enshrined in the charter of human rights. It appeals not to an organic view of society stressing mutual responsibility but rather to an “atomistic” view which exalts the liberal virtues of liberty and freedom from external restraint.
There is, of course, no simple answer to the dilemma as to what should take precedence, the group (society) or the individual. While the excess of the former gives rise to totalitarianism and the latter to anarchy, one’s position ultimately comes down, as with everything else of substance, to one’s personal judgement. Philosophy cannot make that judgement for you, but it can clarify the elements of which any such judgement must take account.
A pleasure as always.
Cheerio!
Really, you don’t think that the violation of charter rights is a big deal? What kind of slippery slope are you allowing them to go down if you don’t stand up for your rights. When and where does it all stop? Take a bit here, take a bit there and next thing you know it’s the Brown Shirts of Nazi Germany all over again.
The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedom states:
Search or seizure
8. Everyone has the right to be secure against unreasonable search or seizure.
Detention or imprisonment
9. Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily detained or imprisoned.
Arrest or detention
10. Everyone has the right on arrest or detention
(a) to be informed promptly of the reasons therefor;
(b) to retain and instruct counsel without delay and to be informed of that right; and
(c) to have the validity of the detention determined by way of habeas corpus and to be released if the detention is not lawful.
Fundamental Freedoms
2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:
(a) freedom of conscience and religion;
(b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication;
(c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and
(d) freedom of association.
You are by law, guaranteed the freedom of peaceful assembly, and protected against unreasonable search & seizure. Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily detained or imprisoned.
So, explain why the police raided the U of T campus to arrest protestors who were all sleeping in a dorm? Violent protestors who are sleeping???? What about the The “violent dispersal of protesters” at the designated G20 protest site at Queen’s Park? The absence of police when acts of vandalism were occurring? The mass arrests and no access to legal counsel?
Why are people being arrested when they are peacefully protesting? Why did the police not do anything while the vandalism was occurring? Why did they mass arrest everybody they saw, regardless?
As you can see, major violations occurred. What’s to stop HPD from pulling the same routine next time there is a protest down at City Hall if you’re not going to care about these kinds of abuses of power?
The one thing you’re missing in all of this is that the Harper Party spent over $1 Billion on this stupid conference!!!!! The things that took place in Nazi Germany & Stalin’s Soviet Republic did not take place overnight. They were slowly implemented over the course of the years. It’s slowly happening now if you step back and take a look at how they’ve been eroded:
http://www.inquisitr.com/135125/canadian-i…
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/stor…
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2009/0…
The last one deemed unconstitutional by the Supreme Court of Canada, yet the Harper Cons argued that they’re needed for national security.
On top of all the links I’ve provided, tack on the new Omnibus Crime Bill. So, you think none of this has any affect on you? You seriously have no problem with the violation of charter rights of others as long as it’s not your’s? If ever Canada becomes another police state like the USA or others, then you sir, are to blame as much as those who allowed it to take place.
First they came for the communists,
and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a Jew.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
and you people think all this shit isn’t already going on. we live in fucking near a police state now.passing any more bills is just a waste of time.as i tried to say earlier, it don’t matter how many they pass, there will be a million loopholes. wasting our time worrying, will do fuck all. the only ones that should be worried, are the crooks and slimeballs like the smelvins. but then again, a good mouthpiece, will only get them a tap on fingers.
a moron i am not tommy. i am a realist, and you know from your own personel experience, what i mean. new bills don’t mean fuck all. cops and courts will do whatever they wish. you can complain all you want to, but still the same shit will always go down.
i know too many assholes hat are on the street right now. if i coul, they would have been history, 2 days after they started.but you can’t be a vigilante, the law frowns on that shit, but then you ask them why they don’t do their jobs, and lo and fucking behold, the same old tired answer. the courts and lawyers. so, tell me again, why you think that i’m a moron? and by the way, if it ever came to someone hurting my bugaaboo, well son, i’ve got a one way ticket to hell for that party.anyway, i started to teach her karate, and judo, witha little killer fu added as an afterthought. su yung kim, would be proud of her, she learns fast, and hits really fucking hard for a 4 year old.
and you people think all this shit isn’t already going on. we live in fucking near a police state now.passing any more bills is just a waste of time.as i tried to say earlier, it don’t matter how many they pass, there will be a million loopholes. wasting our time worrying, will do fuck all. the only ones that should be worried, are the crooks and slimeballs like the smelvins. but then again, a good mouthpiece, will only get them a tap on fingers.
a moron i am not tommy. i am a realist, and you know from your own personel experience, what i mean. new bills don’t mean fuck all. cops and courts will do whatever they wish. you can complain all you want to, but still the same shit will always go down.
i know too many assholes hat are on the street right now. if i coul, they would have been history, 2 days after they started.but you can’t be a vigilante, the law frowns on that shit, but then you ask them why they don’t do their jobs, and lo and fucking behold, the same old tired answer. the courts and lawyers. so, tell me again, why you think that i’m a moron? and by the way, if it ever came to someone hurting my bugaaboo, well son, i’ve got a one way ticket to hell for that party.anyway, i started to teach her karate, and judo, witha little killer fu added as an afterthought. su yung kim, would be proud of her, she learns fast, and hits really fucking hard for a 4 year old.
sorry tommy, that should have been directed at dartmouthy.
Marijuana has powerful self-sustaiability properties. It has health benefits that would put those phizer pricks out of business. It can be used to make clothing, the strongest rope you’ll ever find, food, lotions, salve and a ton of other crap.
It’s a huge crime OP for the same reason that if chi gong caught on hardcore around here that too would be criminalized. Because things like this empower you to be able to take care of yourself. It is profitable to keep you sick and twisted. If you’re really asking yourself why ANY political agenda does what they do, you really need to wake up to the fact that they just want your money. it has nothing to do with conservatives, liberals, NDB or even libertarians or communists or anarchists. Listen to them all really closely and you’ll realize that they’re all saying the exact same thing “We want your money.”
I dunno Ivan, we’re talking about people getting busted for possession. I don’t see providing someone government funded rehab equating to the middle class being suckers. You can get free rehab anyways, can’t you? This FORCES them to go to rehab and try to get clean. I don’t think someone caught with drugs needs years of government funded meals. I would say that’s a waste of my money.
Right now we’re paying for him to be fed and jailed and traumatized, making him likely to relapse. Not to mention he learns from all the other cons how to be a better criminal, also they make connections in there.
So if we’re paying for that already and that’s not working, why wouldn’t we just pay (probably less) for something that does work? I feel like we’re getting suckered right now and decriminalization would be a step in the right direction. I dunno about all drugs but definitely weed. It’s a plant.
Right now we’re paying for drug dealers to become rich, for our children’s schools to be flooded with the shit, for more people to be incarcerated, and various government employees salaries. Nobody wins.
It’s not just Portugal, many countries have justice systems that are more humane than ours and their system works better in terms of crime deterrent.
Nobody’s saying that society failed them, and you could argue that they’re not sick. I’ll also be the first person to tell you that you can’t help someone who doesn’t want to help themselves, but EVERYONE has vices and drug addiction can happen to ANYONE.
I dunno if anyone close to you has ever been an addict, but me personally if my close friend or family member was on the shit I’d wanna see them get better not get shipped off to jail to hang with murderers and criminals for a couple years, far away from anyone who loves or gives a shit about them, and then get out with a slim to nil shot of ever getting a job and probably going back to leeching on society and stealing car stereos to get a blast.
Or he could get better and go back to contributing society. Everyone wins.
What I think would be reasonable:
If you are caught with drugs like crack or meth or coke or oxy, would be to run your prints for any break and enters or robberies in the area. If it is proven that you’re breaking the law, and you successfully argue that it’s to fund your habit, you get a shot at rehab or whatever.
That’s pretty much how it is now isn’t it?
If it works in Portugal give me one good reason it can’t work here.
lol Cheese and crackers, some marathon posts up in here. Well blogged, ladies and gentlemen.
I’ll second that, Tommy. I don’t know if I’ve changed my mind. I certainly don’t have any answers and that is what had me most pissed off yesterday. Anger trumped sense of humor which is never something that I like to allow to happen here. Criminals became the lightning rod for a whole bunch of issues that were grinding at me and emotion ruled my ranting. However, in no particular order
1) My wife’s robbery was the best case of a whole bunch of lousy scenarios. They didn’t put their paws on her, didn’t have to flash any steel, just a simple 2 man distract and grab. They didn’t even care when she blurted out “You robbed me. I’m calling the police”
No security cameras in the store, and the police pretty much admitted that the chances of an arrest were slim to none. It was only afterward that the fear kicked in. I never got a decent night’s sleep when she was working late shifts after that. The memory and fear of what could have happened still burns.
2) Criminals who get sent to prison become better criminals. Probably true. Criminals who avoid arrest also become better criminals. There aren’t a whole lot of Jean Valjeans in the correction system – not a lot of otherwise decent people serving 20 years for stealing a a loaf of bread. I don’t have any compassion for those who break the social contract. I’ve seen long-term cons interviewed describing prison as a jungle, a place where animal instincts take over, where the predators rule, and dignity counts for nothing. I’m sure they are correct, but this is only how they viewed society as a whole. They made the conscious decision to become predators and to view the rest of us citizens as prey. My dad got to liaise with Corrections Canada in Kingston, near the end of his career. He’d tour the prisons, see the wood shops and vocational equipment standing idle, with civilian instructors being paid to play cards. Always a long line at the weight room though. Rehabilitation is a load of shit. Incarceration only protects society in the short term, but it’s better than no protection at all.
3)Yeah there’s an addict in my life. Not the kind of addiction that has led to jail time, but the kind that has cost this individual a marriage, kids and contact with family. Sick? Okay. Victim? Perhaps, but at the very end of a long line of victims.
4) The Toronto Anarchists provoked the situation and it played out like Kabuki theatre. They can all go suck a basket of shit-dipped cocks.
Happy Saturday ,all. And remember – Pass de Duchy pon de lef han side.
morning captain, we will solve all the world’s problems tomorrow, excuse me while i go get wet
This is my bitch if you all didn’t realize it – and yes I appreciate the discussion and I apologize that emotion is all I have left, lol. Some days it really does feel like that.
Does anyone have Coles notes for this for Sunday? I got lost about 10 posts ago… grrooo 🙁
well it was a good bitch dmouth, and didn’t involve the usual suspects. it be otay rosie, i remember everything, that’s why i have nightmares aaaiiieee
Coles notes! Ha ha! I love the bitch but I just can’t make it through the comments!
“Yeah wtf is with the lax laws on sex offenders. “
The sentences were laxed in Cretien’s second term. I am still looking for a link if someone has it.
Roger that, D-Mouthy. I do hear ya.
No way Painey – Tomorrow is for fun and good food.
The world and it’s problems can go piss up a rope.
>: )
oh there will be fun and ribaldry^^
I painted a picture entited “Oh, Canada *Le Sigh*”; based on nothing more than what I saw on our mainstream news media.
How long did it take to get the paint off of your fingers?
So did anyone shed a tear for that piece of shit that just croaked. One of the best pieces of news in years. Too bad it took so long.
I hear ya Bro T…. my sentiments ran more to the victims… now if Bernardo and Pickton would shuffle off this mortal coil… preferably VERY painfully I might feel a little better
Not tear one Konstabel Timofeyevich. I only hope they replaced his morphine with high-octane av-gas for the last week. The devils will be dancing tonite. Maybe he’ll be dorm-mates with that yemeni goatfucker who got Predatored yesterday.
Yemeni goat fucker? Really Col.? lol!
I’m not totally certain but the those fascist Amerikans may have launched a Hellfire missile up the ass of Phineas Freak
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/09/30/…
and the futile “War on Drugs” claims another innocent victim.
If some sick fuck touches my child the wrong way and the system gives them a slap on the wrist then I’ll take care of them in my own way.
I find it very disturbing that child molesters are getting slap on the wrists and allowed to move into places where kids live after.
Death penalty should be given to child molesters rather than giving them a second chance.
I have some experience being one of those kids – let me put it that way… So I get a little fired up when I hear it is equated to pot smoking or growing. Personal experience and all…
Amen to that D-mouthy. Whatever my personal feelings about cannabis; the notion that some sexual deviant can be released into society because he’s paid his debt to the legal system and has only a “moderate” risk to re-offend is nothing less than obscene. I’m sure there are reams of Swedish studies to prove me wrong, but some defects can only be fixed with a bullet.
Aye aye cap’n 😉